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Discussion in 'TiVo Help Center' started by shototsu, Nov 11, 2008.
Glad to hear you got your problem resolved.
Hmmm---interesting. I made a short script that repeatedly did a GET against the URL that our TiVos are posting logs to. The webserver(s) that serve that URL will reply with "Done." to a GET. I never had any trouble repeatably "GETing" that url during my last failed transfer, so it sure looks like it's not a routing issue or a network-weirdness issue. If I had to guess (and I do), it LOOKS like the webserver's mlog.cgi is falling over. I'd give quite a bit to be able to poke around in that server farm's /var/log/httpd directory and see what the error logs are saying.
Update: And finally, the last transfer went successfully:
Ok now we know it is possible to get out of Guided Setup without pulling the drive. (Unless it only became possible since they have been working on it.)
Not sure if I mentioned it here.. but I developed problems with the network again. Then I realized that the router had become partially unplugged. I don't think that was the original problem though.. I think that was only after I pulled the drive.
Glad it is working for you!
interesting that both of us were stuck in Guided Setup without being able to telnet and the fix for the telnet was simply a connection issue. (My router was partially unplugged and your TurboNet was coming loose.)
So the moral is... just because (whatever) sort of works doesn't mean its connected properly.. it might be coming loose.
Maybe we should call or write to our local news channels and let them know of our issue. It is not fair for people to be being told, "It's your old machine" when everyone at Tivo Support should be aware of this issue. People could throw a perfectly good Tivo in the garbage due to the response of Support.
If we call the news, I don't think we should say.. "They are just trying to get rid of Series 1 users" type stuff. Let the news programs do their own investigation of it. (Well if we said the "they just want to be rid of us" stuff.. I guess the news people would act faster because it would be more exciting.. but doesn't seem right to me.)
If this was reported on the news, at least then the average consumer could be made aware that they are not alone with their problem.
And what more would you like TiVo to do about this than they are now?
Jerry has already said they're trying to gather as much detailed info on this as possible to find out what's wrong.
I mean, yeah, it stinks, but at the same time it's not like they're not doing anything. That fact of the matter is that the CSR who tried to say "Your bix is old, get a new one" was out of line and higher ups at TiVo aren't taking that tone.
Tried a different area code and the test call went ok but still got the same call interrupted error. Tried my local numbers again but still get call interrupted on downloading. Sent my TSN to TivoJerry with all info so will wait and see. In the meantime I will just keep trying. Glad to see others have had their issues resolved.
did you try the areacodes reported as working? i realize that some may have long distance constraints but the localization theory seems to prove out...
Yes, I tried the Phoenix phone number. Got the numbers and did a test call which worked ok. Did a call now and got to the downloading stage and about 5 min later got call interrupted. I am going to put an external modem on this weekend and see if it helps, but do not really think that it is the modem.
Did you choose the 602 605-1880 number? That is the only one I have used recently and is the one that works for me.
This continues to baffle me as the problem just seems so random; as I've mentioned earlier I don't have the technical expertise a lot of you guys and ladies have so I'm clueless.
I just know my box in the 602 area code is working near perfection now. I have had a single failure since it went on that run and that may have been completely unrelated to the problem we have been dealing with. Worked fine again this am and all my data is up to date.
Good luck to all; just hang in there as they are obviously testing a fix or possibly rolling it out in different areas at a time.
I guess... But like I mentioned, I'm clueless.
Yes, that is the number that I used. I am going to try it again tonight and also the CA numbers. Guess I will be babysitting the Tivo this weekend so I can get my program data. Glad yours is now working.
on a side note, i got a real appreciation for the Tivo S1. i have a dish dvr which is a tivo wannabe on sterods. good functionality but i miss the seamless tivo UI. i had never hacked into my tivo save for installing an instantcaked drive and installing a turbonet adapter (bundled it off for my kid to use while away in college). with this incident i got to telnet / ftp and TTY into the box. i further discovered that tivoweb is already on the image so i can control it remotely - for a 10 yr old box, not bad at all!
While I take erniebert up on his offer, please continue to send your TSNs. Rest assured that I'm adding your info to my tracking doc even if you don't hear from me.
It would save me some time if those of you connecting via phone answer the following questions, as some of these may not be related:
What is the error message(s) you're seeing?
Are you using VOIP, magicjack, or any other digital phone service?
Do you have DSL? <make sure you have a filter, try another, disconnect all others for testing>
Have you bypassed any splitters, tried a new cord and wall jack?
Have you tried to connect to any other local numbers?
If you could take a moment to dial the number exactly as displayed on your DVR, please tell me if the call connects and you hear a handshake. <there's always the possibility that the dialing format requirements have changed in your area and you now need to dial 10 or 11 digits>
Just sent my TSN and the answers to those questions to you, TivoJerry.
I'll just add that my symptoms are exactly as described by others in this thread (e.g., problem beginning in December time frame, combination of Service Unavailable and Call Interrupted errors, same issue regardless of local number, Tivo 800 number, or changes to dialing options, etc.).
I was able to successfully complete a call yesterday only by forcing one daily call after another. It went like this:
Call 1: Failed. Call Interrupted. (This was after a successful connection and ~10 minutes of downloading.)
Call 2: Same as Call 1.
Call 3: Failed. Service Unavailable. (This was a few hours later.)
Call 4: Failed. Service Unavailable.
Call 5: Succeeded.
Tivo hasn't successfully completed a call on its own (without me forcing the call) in many weeks. I'm on a standard phone line with a Phillips series 1 dating from September 2000.
while i had reported that i had successfully dialed in with local numbers (and remote too) as well as via turbonet, i did not check all the previous numbers I had dialed. out of 4 areacodes i tried calling, one failed. what's interesting was that immediately after the failed dial, i tried turbonet and that failed too with the same symptoms as before. when i telneted into the box i found that it could get to local addresses (within the LAN) but not outside the router(such as the TIVO destination IP). i rebooted the box and that restored connectivity outside the router. it also got me through a forced call via the turbonet.
I swapped back to dialup and did another test tonight. Tonight was the night that dialup didn't "just work" for me, but instead fought tooth&nail -- which is good and bad. Bad in that I had to fight with my unit to get a data download, but good in that I had some time to test.
I telneted in to my TiVo from two different consoles. In one, I did a "tail -f" on /var/log/tclient. On the other, I typed in an ntpdate command which bounces a bunch of network activity off of the TiVo servers when it runs.
So, when the logs got to the point where they were hanging:
I was able to successfully execute repeated ntpdate commands to TiVo -- which proves that the network *was* up, functioning, and routing from my box to the TiVo network. Snippet follows:
So...during the time that the transmission was "hanging" (with my TiVo saying "Connecting" and eventually switching to "Failed: Service Unavailable"), the network was up and running. I think this proves that it's not a "dialup" problem, a "router" problem, etc...this pretty much proves that a unit that is successfully connected to the network can have download issues.
Now...I guess the next question is, is my unit the only one with this exact issue? How would we go about determining that?
For the record, my unit is a Philips Series 1, running 3.0.01-1-000.
I was not trying to say that Tivo was not working on the issue. I was not trying to say that all Tivo reps are snotty.. I was not even trying to say that any of them are. My message was not referring to anyone.
I do not think it is acceptable that when a user calls support with this issue, they are told, "Your box is defective." it does not matter how nicely they say it.. it is the WRONG answer. Of course it is always possible that the box is defective.. but the caller should ALSO be told that there is an issue going on right now that they might be experiencing. They should be told about the possible fixes that have been found in this thread.
How would you feel if you did not know there was a possibility it was NOT your Tivo.. and you threw your perfectly good Tivo in the garbage because support told you that it was broken?
There is no excuse for support not to be aware of this issue when it has been going on for well over 2 months.
I thought maybe we could get the word out through the media so people would not throw away completly good Tivos, or go around saying.. "Tivo is trying to get rid of us!"
I do not think it is too much to expect that Tivo Support stop telling users that their Tivo is broken when there is a good chance that they have this problem. Since there APPEARS to be no effort to train support, the only option we have is the media.
Why do you think that your unit is the only one with the problem? I just think that you are the only one posting the detailed logs. I also have problems where it says connecting for a long time and the stuff that you list. But I don't have broadband or the expertise to prove it like you have.
I also have the same unit and OS as you.
Thanks for the great posts,
That looks like the best data yet that points to where the problem is. I wish I could tell you mine is doing the exact same thing but I don't have turbonet to try it. I can tell you mine all hang and exhibit the same symptons, so I would assume we're all in the same boat.
Do you or anyone else happen to have some logs from a daily call prior to December 2008? Maybe if we could compare a successful call from November to a failed and successful call now we could see a difference like maybe something tivo changed with the communications.
i don't think it's a dialup or network problem either. maybe it's something in the backend that has changed. maybe the server farm got moved to a bunch of vmware instances, who knows? TIVO will never tell us the dirty details. to me it seems to be network tuning issues at the backend as shown by timeouts and out of sync acks / retry you posted before. There's a good article over at SUN describing TCP downloads over slow links (complete with fancy, geeky pictures):
this would apply to dialup as well, since the isp has to traverse the WAN to get to the TIVO servers. my turbonet connection seems to be working now, but has failed once after a failed dialup. looked like the routing tables got messed up - a reboot cleared that issue.