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Series 1 not downloading data

Discussion in 'TiVo Help Center' started by shototsu, Nov 11, 2008.

  1. brendag4

    brendag4 New Member

    117
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    Apr 9, 2005
    Broke down and pulled the drive.

    Renamed one of the log files because I thought that was what one report had said to do. Did not work with 1 call.

    Pulled drive again. Renamed log directory. I think the first time I got the Call interrupted error. Tried again and went to bed while it was working. Woke up and it said Service unavailable. Tried again.. and it completed way too fast. It just immediately marked the items as Done. (Well I dont remember if it did the Connecting, setting the clock thing.. but only took a few minutes and not 20-30.) Now it is saying it needs to process the data for 4-8 hours.

    I still cannot telnet. Is this because it is processing the data, or is it going to be that something else is wrong? I do not have a light anymore for the Tivo on the router. I had it throughout trying to fix this problem until now.
     
  2. brendag4

    brendag4 New Member

    117
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    Apr 9, 2005
    Dancar, the only reason I knew I had a problem was because I was checking the screens. I did not find the problem because of getting an out of program data message. I just noticed that some shows would have no description.. so I went in and would see the Call Interrupted message. Just figured the modem was getting flaky until I tried to do a Guided Setup. Then I could not get out of it until I renamed the log directory.

    I would say keep checking your screen every day and see if you are getting a lot of the messages. If so, don't do a Guided Setup. I would say force it if it if you got the message because no telling when you might get hit hard.

    I am not sure where Bainbridge Island is.. but do you have the equipment they mention such as a router or sniffer that can do a traceroute? (I am in Tacoma)
     
  3. joeysmith

    joeysmith New Member

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    Jan 9, 2002
    a sniffer is just a computer that can inspect network packets and their contents. the tcpdump described somewhere on the thread can provide some of that information. a traceroute (tracert on some computers) is a command on most OS's showing hops from router to router from an originating computer to a destination host or ip address (example tracert www.tivo.com) . traceroute can show latency or where the connection's route is failing or timing out.
     
  4. dlee0708

    dlee0708 New Member

    115
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    Sep 20, 2002
    Lewisville, TX
    Just an update. I just sent my hub to my mom, so hopefully in a couple of days I can get her to put the hub in place and I think I already loaded wireshark on her computer and will be able to capture the traffic and send to Tivo Engineering as TivoJerry has asked.

    One thing, I am not sure my moms problem is exactly the same as everyone elses. She cannot complete a test call or daily call at all. It never gets past the connecting stage. It does have some network connectivity because I had her log into the router she could see the IP address and then I had my her ping the Tivo IP address and it responded. So I am assuming its able to get a connection outside the router, but I can't be for sure. There is only one other person on here I believe that had the same similar symptoms. Everyone else seems to be able to get past the connecting stage.
     
  5. dlee0708

    dlee0708 New Member

    115
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    Sep 20, 2002
    Lewisville, TX

    You can get a the wireshark sniffer free at http://www.wireshark.org/download.html . You can load this onto your computer and see all the network traffic coming to and from your computer.

    The trick is to see the network traffic to/from the Tivo. It used to be all you had to do is get a hub, connect the hub to your router, then connect the Tivo and your computer to the hub and you are set.

    The problem is all the multi-connection devices now are Ethernet Switches which reduce network traffic by only sending data to your computer that are addressed to your computer instead of all the traffic. Therefore your computer (and therefore wireshark) can't see any data sent/received to the Tivo that goes to Tivo Inc. I went to Frys and I couldn't even find a hub. But I ended digging thru all my old junk and finally found an old one.

    So unless you can get a hold of an old dumb hub (or if you have a real expensive Ethernet switch with management capabilites to turn on a port to receive all data) then the sniffer isn't going to help.
     
  6. joeysmith

    joeysmith New Member

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    Jan 9, 2002
    i've had problems not getting past the "connecting" stage. yesterday, it changed and i got past it (only to fail at download). once it failed, though, it will continue to fail until something changes on the other side. last night i quit after it started failing on "connecting" again using turbonet. will try again later...
     
  7. Monty

    Monty New Member

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    Dec 5, 2001
    Flanders,NJ
    It seems to me, that once it misses the daily call your in trouble. For instance if I'm 12 days behind it took 12 calls to catch up. (Providing it's able to connect and get to downloading). It hits the "call interrupted" message it seems, for the end of each day of the download.

    Monty
     
  8. ciper

    ciper New Member

    2,010
    0
    Nov 4, 2004
    I've shared a sniff of a working series one to TiVoJerry. RAR'd it was 5.6mb

    I hope all of you have taken the time to send your packet captures!
     
  9. TiVoJerry

    TiVoJerry 00-16 TiVo Employee

    1,511
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    Jul 26, 2005
    Alviso, CA
    I know I'm opening up a can of worms for my PM inbox, but for anyone affected by this can you send me your TSN. I have been given something to try and need a few volunteers.
     
  10. badcrc

    badcrc Thread Killer

    166
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    Aug 21, 2000
    Bremerton WA
    I've been having this problem since early December too. I can do test calls and force daily calls and only about 1 out of 4 go through, and of those that do, only about 1 out of 3 test calls succeed, and only about 1 out of 4-5 daily calls succeed.

    This isn't my experience, but I would think the more days you are behind, the more data you would have to download to catch up, which means a longer phone call and more chance you get disconnected by one of these weird errors. I ran out of guide data completely on two of my tivos which is how I discovered the problem, but I didn't have to make 12 calls, only about 6 to get a successful download. The first tivo that ran out of data I assumed was because of a fluke of having 3 tivos on the same phone line competing to download while using the same line for voice calls. When it happened to another tivo I kept an eye on it and realized most of the calls were failing.
     
  11. joeysmith

    joeysmith New Member

    95
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    Jan 9, 2002

    Finally, PROGRESS!!!:eek:

    ps. I'm not going to try and finish my guided setup until there's some kind of resolution.
     
  12. mec1991

    mec1991 Cranky old coot

    659
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    Nov 5, 2004
    Back home...
    Jerry,

    Is this for dialup users also?
     
  13. bittmann

    bittmann Member

    68
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    Apr 19, 2005
    South...
    No, I didn't, because I couldn't prove it (and besides, it could've been a red herring anyway). But, while flailing around mightily earlier tonight, I *may* have been able to capture a series of forced connections that had "issues", and also the final forced connection that actually completed the job. So, I PMed TivoJerry, and we'll see if he thinks that this will contribute anything usable.

    What I did notice -- the connection does seem to be somewhat "progressive". My first attempt actually shoveled across quite a few packets, my second, third, and fourth transferred less than 1/10th of the number of packets as compared to the first transfer, then my 5th (and successful!) transfer barely transferred more data than the 3 previous small "unsuccessful" transfers...but nevertheless, the TiVo liked the last transfer and went into "loading data". So, seems that when you do connect, the transfers can be (for want of a better word) "cumulative".

    That may explain why clearing the logfiles actually helps -- if there isn't any accumulated data to cumulatively transfer (;)), you don't have the problem of the upload stalling out, so the download can simply roll.

    BittMann
     
  14. dlee0708

    dlee0708 New Member

    115
    0
    Sep 20, 2002
    Lewisville, TX
    Just my $0.02 here. TivoJerry has asked for network data on a failing Tivo so they can figure on which end is breaking almost a week ago and we haven't been able to get them the data, so its not like they haven't been trying.

    I hope to be able to get the Network data early next week when my mom gets my hub.
     
  15. brendag4

    brendag4 New Member

    117
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    Apr 9, 2005
    Various responses below..

    :-D

    Hmm... I wonder what the lead is.. I PM'ed him about renaming the log directory fixing my issue and he responded by asking for my TSN. I am a dialup user. I also offered to upload him my log directory because I renamed it.. I did not delete it. But he did not respond to that part of the PM. So I asked again if he wants it. Maybe he didn't respond because it would not do them any good.
    --
    dlee0708 and others thanks for the info on wireshark etc

    dlee0708,

    Yes, we need to be thankful that Tivo is even bothering.. because many companies would have told us too bad, your stuff is too old for us to care. They have been trying to get info out of us and we have not been giving them what they need.

    About the connection issue... yes I sometimes can't connect but it is almost always the downloading failed error. There are also people who get Service Unavailable who fix it by deleting the log directory.
    --
    I fixed the telnet by doing stuff like rebooting the Tivo and computer and fiddling with the router settings. I do not know if it was related to getting stuck in Guided Setup or not. It did coincide with it.

    BrendaG4
     
  16. joeysmith

    joeysmith New Member

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    Jan 9, 2002
    i know people have been trying, but this is the first i hear that there is "something to try" from engineering and not trying to find out what's wrong with the hundreds of S1's failing right now, which is what the CSR's will try to do if you call...
     
  17. badcrc

    badcrc Thread Killer

    166
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    Aug 21, 2000
    Bremerton WA
    I don't want to start an argument but the above statement brushed me the wrong way. First, I assume you are aware many of us have lifetime SERVICE, which means for the life of the box they have to provide service. Your statement sounds like they're doing us a favor by providing service we already paid for.

    Secondly, since when is it our responsibility to provide logs and all this other info to fix a problem tivo caused to start with? Sure none of us have a problem with providing them that info, but it's not our fault they can't gather the data needed from their own test machines...and they do have Series 1 machines of their own they can get data from.

    Lastly, if you read the thread regarding the suggestions problem, it sounds suspiciously similar to this problem in regards to everyone starting to have the issue at a certain date, lack of CSR help, lack of interest by tivo employees, and tivo relying on S1 users to help them fix it. I would bet it ends up being a change they made in early December, and it will probably be another mystery fix without a real software update.

    None of this is meant to be directed at tivojerry or tivopony who have been great over the years and seem to be our only links to real assistance.

    P.S. Is there a way to get them that info without turbonet? I have an old 24 port HP hub, three S1 tivos, two of them using built in modem, and one of them using an external modem. If anyone lives in the Kitsap County area in Washington and has turbonet and wants to use my hub, maybe we could work something out.
     
  18. bittmann

    bittmann Member

    68
    0
    Apr 19, 2005
    South...
    Aha! I think that I was able to get another tcpdump of a complete fail/fail/succeed download. I ran a couple of tcpdumps this time, one to log all of the packets coming to/from my TiVo, and another logging all traffic from 204.176.49.2. To help indicate that there weren't any "network" issues between my system and TiVo's, I ran a continual 10-second-interval ping from my gateway to the TiVo server. The "internal" tcpdump has all 3 transfer attempts captured (yay!), and the "external" tcpdump has the 2nd and 3rd attempt captured.

    I'll PM this info to TivoJerry in case it's of any interest.

    BittMann
     
  19. joeysmith

    joeysmith New Member

    95
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    Jan 9, 2002
    Good to have what you've done documented. You have probably saved us many days of waiting! Out of curiousity, what does a traceroute to Tivo look like from your boxes? Are there any killer hops? I seriously doubt this has anything to do with the problem because of the widespread incidence.

    Thanks
     
  20. BobCamp1

    BobCamp1 Active Member

    1,348
    8
    May 15, 2002
    Tivo has an option to connect to a PC via serial PPP. http://www.tivohelp.com/archive/tivohelp.swiki.net/45.html

    If you run Wireshark on the PC, you should be able to capture the data going back and forth.

    The problem is, it's a new setup, so when you have the problem you might not know if it's your new setup or the bug you're trying to capture.
     

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