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S3 issue (not sure where I should start)

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by chrishicks, Oct 27, 2013.

  1. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    ok - just ordered the power supply. my model # is TCD652160

    Do you know if weakness includes instructions on how to remove/replace the power supply board? I build my own pc's so im sure it may be self explanatory, but ive never opened a TiVo unit before.
     
  2. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    I just don't trust myself with soldering. I'll leave that to the pros.

    Again thank you for your help Diane. Id send you a virtual bouquet of roses if I knew you :)
     
  3. dianebrat

    dianebrat I refuse to accept your reality TCF Club

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    If you build your own PCs it should be more than obvious, the Tivo innards are really simple compared to a PC, obviously make sure it's unplugged.
     
  4. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    thank you Diane - i'll keep you posted.
     
  5. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    semi-coastal NC
    You'll need a #10 Torx driver to unscrew the screws holding the cover/lid/top onto the TiVo chassis.

    I'm pretty sure there are 6 of them.

    Get an old aspirin bottle or something like that in which to put them.

    (they like to sneak off when your back is turned if you just leave them lying on the bench)

    Once you have all the screws out (don't take out the 4 holding the fan or any of the little ones in there among all the input/output jacks, just the ones that go through the black part), you need to slide the top back from the front, and you may have to put some muscle on it to get it to let go.

    It fits very, very snugly and well.

    You can try a small pry bar or a big flat blade screwdriver to stick under the black parts at the sides, or get someone to hold the top steady and tap the back of the chassis with a rubber hammer to try to get it to break free.

    Once you can get it moved back about an inch or so you can lift it straight up.

    Did I mention that you should not have anything, especially the power cord, plugged into the back of the TiVo while doing this?

    And did I mention rule number 1?

    ALWAYS KNOW WHERE BOTH ENDS OF THE POWER CORD ARE AT ALL TIMES!

    Once you've got the top off, you can see the power supply on the right (looking from the front).

    There are (I think) 6 screws holding the power supply circuit board to the chassis and they also take a #10 Torx bit.

    Then there's the sneaky hidden one.

    Look on the back from the outside just above where the power cord jack is.

    There's a small dark screw that goes into the upper plastic part of the AC input jack from the outside of the chassis. For that one you need a #8 Torx bit.

    You'll need to unplug the combo power/data plug from the internal hard drive and unplug the data end from the motherboard.

    And you'll need to squeeze the release tab and unplug the thing that looks a lot like an ATX power supply motherboard plug.

    Be careful not to dislodge the ribbon cable that goes from the motherboard to the front panel. I don't know if they still have them rigged to burn something out if the motherboard end isn't fully and properly seated the way the Series 2s were, but let's not take the chance.

    Once you do all the unscrewing and unplugging, the power supply board should lift right out.

    And you should have put the screws for it in another aspirin bottle. If you've had a TiVo and a PC for very long, you should have plenty of empty aspirin bottles.

    I know you can send the old supply back for a core charge refund, but you'll eat up a chunk of that on shipping, and there's no guarantee that the capacitors on the replacement board you're about to install aren't about to go bad any day now, so you might consider keeping the old one and learning how to replace the caps (I can tell you how), and that way you'll have a spare.

    The Series 3 HD (which is what the 652 is) and the HD XL (which is the 658, and looks the same as the 652 on the outside, just has a bigger internal drive stock) use the same power supplies.

    I say supplies because there are two different ones from two different subcontractors, 3Y Power Technology and AcBel, so the one you get may not look like the one you're replacing (and the list of caps for each is different), but either supply will work with any 652 or 658.

    If you want to put new caps in the old one, let me know which model it is.
     
  6. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    Wow thanks so much for this very thorough post. :) :)
     
  7. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    Hi Diane and unitron,

    Unfortunately, after I swapped out the new power supply (ridiculously easy), I still am having the same problem. I get no signal on any channels now. (I have not used the unit since Nov 5.) I reran guided set up but did not do a clear and delete everything. Still nothing. As a test, I watched a few previously recorded shows and they played fine. MRV works just fine, as does streaming music through "Live 365".

    I connected the cable wire directly to the tv, bypassing the TiVo, and cable works great. But once I go through the TiVo, im getting a black screen with the dancing bubble that says "waiting for cable in".

    Here's what ive done so far:

    1) replaced power supply
    2) called cable co to unpair and repair
    3) ran repeat guided set up.

    I am at a loss... I just don't know what to do at this point. Any help you can provide would be very appreciative.

    Thanks
     
  8. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC

    Have you ever tried using the Over The Air tuners on that TiVo?

    Have you got at least one local broadcast station somewhat near?

    Can you borrow a pair of rabbit ears from somebody?

    If you get the same problem on the OTA tuners that tells us one thing and if they work flawlessly that tells us something else.
     
  9. telemark

    telemark New Member

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    Nov 12, 2013
    Different devices require different levels of Signal to decode the video. If you have another Tivo of the same model, in the same location, then that's the best data point.

    Also, pay attention to which channels are encrypted vs which ones are not. Then start with only the non-encrypted ones to rule out the CableCard.

    To me it sounds like borderline signal quality (pixelated image), combined with some kind of instability (unexplained reboots) on the system.

    I would read over the logs in /var/log/
    Particularly, tverr and kernel and messages.

    Aren't there a lot of diagnostic screens for the Tuners and Cable Card? I would look through those too.

    If if there is a signal quality problem, using thicker Coax, reducing the length, reducing the of number splitter, or adding a distribution amp, can do wonders.
     
  10. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    Thanks - I plan to go to best buy tomorrow and get an ota antenna. For now, I get nothing - no signal whatsoever. All channels. When I connect the cable directly to the tv (bypassing the TiVo), signal comes in nice and clear on all channels. Ive already swapped out the cable card, and the power supply. I'll do what unitron suggested and will post results.

    Thanks.
     
  11. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    Ok - OTA antenna works great. Now what?
    (and thanks in advanced)
     
  12. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    semi-coastal NC
    So there are no more analog channels on your cable?

    And all of the digitial ones require a cable card?

    Do you have an old VCR still hanging around, or something else that puts out an analog Channel 3 or 4 signal like they had to do back in the pre-digital broadcast days when lots of TVs had no input except the ones to the VHF and UHF tuners?

    I have 652 that does great on digital OTA (which is one 2 tuner tuner module), and on the other 2 tuner tuner module, the cable one, tuner 0 can't lock in an analog cable channel, but tuner 1 does it just fine. We're still on analog cable, so I don't have cable cards so that I can test the cable tuner module on digital cable channels.

    But I'm starting to suspect that we may be starting to see the capacitor plague problem manifest itself in one or more of the capacitors on the motherboard itself, which is going to be a few orders of magnitude more of a royal PITA to deal with than on the power supplies.

    If you could feed your cable tuner a known good analog (NTSC) signal on channel 3 or 4, then whether you could tune that or not with one or both of your cable tuners would give us further clues as to whether to blame your cable tuner or the cable card part of the equation.
     
  13. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    Yea unfortunately, the analog was removed from our cable system 10 months ago. Sorry I don't have a VCR here. I have no access to an analog signal.

    So basically I think i'm hosed on this one...

    Any ideas on finding a new TiVo hd with lifetime. I don't need the cost of a premier or a roamio.
     
  14. HerronScott

    HerronScott Well-Known Member

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    Staunton, VA
    eBay and I think they've dropped slightly since the release of the Roamio's - $250-$350.

    Scott
     
  15. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    thanks. checking it out now.
     
  16. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    semi-coastal NC
    Just wanted to be sure you tried both cable tuners simultaneously, as in punch in a channel number, then hit the Live TV button to switch tuners and punch in a different channel number, so that you know each is on a different channel number from the other, and then go into the menus to DVR diagnostics and see what it has to say about both tuners.
     
  17. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    yes I played with it last night - switch back and forth from antenna to cable, antenna channels worked good (a few couldn't grab the signal but that was more from my antenna placement than a faulty tuner.

    Im off to ebay to find a new one - i'll just swap out the hard drive when I get it.

    I want to thank you whole heartedly for your help.


     
  18. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    If you are under the impression that moving the hard drive will move a lifetime subscription from one motherboard to another, I regret to inform you that it will not.

    Product Lifetime Service is tied to the TiVo Service Number (the motherboard tells the hard drive what the TSN is, not the other way around), and begining with the 652s and 658s, this number is stored inside the main CPU, which is a custom chip with a CPU and a bunch of the video processing and other stuff, like what used to be on a separate crypto chip where the TSN used to be kept from the S1 to the original S3, the 648, and said CPU is, for all practical purposes, not movable to another motherboard of the same model.

    If what you have is a lifetimed 652 that works on OTA channels just fine, but not cable channels, you could keep it, especially if it's the anchor unit for Multi-Set Discounts on your other TiVos if they're by the month, or if you'll need an MSD on a lifetime sub for a new TiVo anytime soon, and just use it as an OTA machine and place where you can copy over non-copy protected shows from the other TiVos to increase the number of viewing locations.

    It has less value without cable tuners, but it's still lifetimed, does OTA and MRV, and has a good power supply, so it's not absolutely worthless.
     
  19. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    Sorry I wasn't clear - I plan to buy a replacement unit with the small stock 160 gig hard drive (I never thought id see the day that id say 160 gig HD was considered small - lol) with lifetime and just swap out my existing 2 Ter HD with the new unit. Not sure what id do with the one that's broken. Probably sell it on ebay for parts - of course clearly stating the problem I have. Or as you suggest, use it for a unit to watch transferred shows...

     
  20. tough joe

    tough joe New Member

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    Sep 16, 2006
    Hey Unitron

    I just got in the new S3 - same model as my old one. I booted it up to make sure it worked and it works great. So I unplugged the new one, opened both cases, swapped the hard drive from my old (nonworking cable tunner) one to the new one. I also plugged in the cablecard before powering the new one up.

    This is where I run into a minor issue. It sat on the "TiVo is starting up" screen for about 25 minutes. When I came back from jogging, live tv was playing nicely. But when I pressed Tivo Central button on remote, I get an erro that stated "TiVo has encountered a hardware error - you are unable to record or watch recordings until you reboot' Do you want to a) reboot, b) skip this, c) delete message.

    I think I may have swapped the HD out in the wrong order... Any help is appreciated..
     

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