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Random Reboots

Discussion in 'TiVo Premiere DVRs' started by aadam101, Apr 3, 2012.

  1. Apr 3, 2012 #1 of 31
    aadam101

    aadam101 Tell me a joke

    7,029
    0
    Jul 14, 2002
    Massachusetts
    One of my premieres constantly reboots. I don't think it's a software issue because my other unit is just fine. Both are connected via MoCa.

    It reboots even when I am not actually using it. Many times it happens in the middle of recording and I have noticed it reboot even when nothing is recording and the TV is turned off.

    Is it probably the hard drive? It's the newer unit of the two so I am very disappointed. It's only about 18 months old.

    Could it be something besides the hard drive?
     
  2. Mar 8, 2014 #2 of 31
    pninen

    pninen New Member

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    Jun 25, 2003
    There are several threads here with lots of people reporting this problem, so no I don't think its your hardware. Its got to be software.
     
  3. Mar 8, 2014 #3 of 31
    CoxInPHX

    CoxInPHX COX Communications

    2,350
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    Jan 14, 2011
    Phoenix, AZ
  4. Mar 8, 2014 #4 of 31
    pninen

    pninen New Member

    103
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    Jun 25, 2003
    I contacted TiVo, and their customer service seems to be unaware of a pattern of users experiencing random reboots. This came as a shock to me, because I see so many people reporting this problem here.

    I suggested they read tivocommunity.com to see many examples of users with this problem, but they did not respond to my suggestion.

    Here's their response. It is frustratingly script-like, and doesn't seem to address the problem. The notion that signal strength should cause a computer to reboot is nonsensical.

    I promptly responded with the numbers they asked for.

    I STRONGLY SUGGEST THAT ANYONE HAVING THE RANDOM REBOOT PROBLEM FILE A SUPPORT REQUEST ON THE TIVO WEB SITE. Until they have large numbers of users contacting them, they won't get it.
     
  5. Mar 9, 2014 #5 of 31
    CoxInPHX

    CoxInPHX COX Communications

    2,350
    6
    Jan 14, 2011
    Phoenix, AZ
    TiVo Support is clueless and would not admit it if they knew. I once asked TiVo Support to contact Margret and get the info from her, since she was already aware of the issue, Support said they had no way to contact her? Strange, since I can email her directly.

    I send all my legitimate requests for support directly to Margret Schmidt (TiVo's Chief Design Officer and Vice President of Design & Engineering)
    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/member.php?u=198507
    https://twitter.com/tivodesign

    She usually responds right away.
     
  6. Mar 9, 2014 #6 of 31
    dcstager

    dcstager 1st Gen Tivo Owner

    573
    2
    Feb 16, 2002
    Skagit...
    Mine started rebooting too. I was watching baseball on MLB and I thought it might be related to that. It's been very reliable for almost two years.
     
  7. Mar 9, 2014 #7 of 31
    CoxInPHX

    CoxInPHX COX Communications

    2,350
    6
    Jan 14, 2011
    Phoenix, AZ
    Margret responded to my email and has turned on additional logging on my TiVos. So hopefully they will find the issue.

    My Roamio Pro rebooted again today, Sun, March 9, 2014 @ 1:12 PM - Arizona Time (PDT) - 8:12 PM (UTC)
    No one was using the DVR at the time, TV was off.

    The Roamio Pro had already uploaded the logs,
    Last Service Connection was 1:33 PM - Arizona Time (PST)
    Last VCM Connection was 1:37 PM - Arizona Time (PST)
     
  8. ByteRider

    ByteRider New Member

    1
    0
    Mar 10, 2014
    *chuckle* ... just joined the forum because I was looking for anyone else having the same problem. My Premiere XL4 just started to do the random reboot/restart thing on Saturday (could have been earlier, but that's when I first noticed it).

    Forum won't let me send an email to Margret because I have to have 10 posts ... so I'm just going to lurk on this thread and would appreciate it if there is any more info if is could be posted.

    Many thanks.
     
  9. CrispyCritter

    CrispyCritter Purple Ribbon Wearer

    3,646
    1
    Feb 28, 2001
    North...
    Unless it was earlier, with high probability it's an unconnected problem. You might want to do a kickstart testing of your drives (google TiVo kickstart).

    A back-of-the-envelope calculation says that over 100 retail TiVos die every single day due to disk failures. (900,000 disks in TiVos * 5% annual failure rate = 45,000 disk failures per year.)

    What makes the CoxInPHX and the other failures stand out is their common start date with mulitple TiVos in a household starting to fail. That makes it sound like a bad guide data problem (I'm still suspicious of the daylight savings time timing.)

    For those interested in disk failure rates, Backblaze has a nice article I hadn't seen before with new data at http://blog.backblaze.com/2013/11/12/how-long-do-disk-drives-last/
     
  10. jwbelcher

    jwbelcher New Member

    489
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    Nov 13, 2007
    Orlando, FL
    The other interesting thing is that CoxInPHX, nooneuknow, and myself are all on drives less than 6 months old. Its hard for me to think we all had drive drive issues (especially nooneuknows multiple roamios).

    I've been watching GC, indexing and service connect, but haven't found a relationship yet. I'm waiting it out to see if it resolves itself before running the guided setup again to download new guide data.

    Based on nooneuknow's comment about library building, I've deleted a few series having 60+ recording to see if it helps. My last reboot was early Sunday morning before we got up. There was some recordings going on at that time, but given TiVo constantly writes to disk, I don't know if that's relevant.

    I sent Margret another email, but haven't heard back yet. I'd like to avoid RMA if at all possible. Does anyone know if they're replacing Roamios with refurbished units yet?
     
  11. TiVoMargret

    TiVoMargret VP Product Dev, TiVo

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    Feb 2, 2008
    Silicon Valley
    We found an interaction between the box and the service that was causing some random reboots. We made a change to the service last night that should resolve the problem. Please make a connection to the TiVo Service.

    If you experience more than one reboot after making the connection to the TiVo Service, please email me your TSN with the subject "Random Reboots". (margret@tivo.com)

    I am very sorry for the trouble!
    --Margret
     
  12. Sixto

    Sixto Member

    246
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    Sep 16, 2005
  13. nooneuknow

    nooneuknow TiVo User Since 2007

    3,554
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    Feb 5, 2011
    Cox Cable...
    Recent random reboot problem (multiple platforms) - TiVoMargret responds!

    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10039469#post10039469

    Great to hear!

    However, if this "service interaction issue" causing the reboots caused any corruption of the databases/structures as a result of the primary cause, my advice in this post http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10038994#post10038994 may clean up any lingering issues.

    If us TiVo users didn't have TiVoMargret, this issue would likely be repeatedly denied by the TiVo CS Reps, as even existing, go on for months, and we'd all be stuck doing the CSR scripted support dance, which usually includes finding any way to blame the problem on anything except TiVo (the product and/or the company).
     
  14. MPSAN

    MPSAN Active Member

    1,193
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    Jun 20, 2009
    Portland,...
    Email sent. Thank you Margret.
     
  15. dcstager

    dcstager 1st Gen Tivo Owner

    573
    2
    Feb 16, 2002
    Skagit...
    I'm still getting random reboots, so far only while using the MLB app. The MLB service is so cool, I'd hate to lose it to keep the TiVo stable.
     
  16. jrtroo

    jrtroo User

    4,062
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    Feb 4, 2008
    Let us know what happens after you email Margret.
     
  17. Sixto

    Sixto Member

    246
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    Sep 16, 2005
  18. MPSAN

    MPSAN Active Member

    1,193
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    Jun 20, 2009
    Portland,...
    So far, she has not returned a response to me.
     
  19. nooneuknow

    nooneuknow TiVo User Since 2007

    3,554
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    Feb 5, 2011
    Cox Cable...
    I was looking forward to reading it... Then I did, and kept hoping the article would soon deviate from trying to force her into saying something like "Yeah, I guess being a woman is tough" or "Yeah, I feel discriminated against and that my pay is unfair, because I'm a woman".

    I'm was surprised at the tiny amount related to TiVo, and that the interviewer didn't ask if she prefers winged feminine products over others.

    It was like the intent was for a title of "One woman's struggle with unemployment, and finding a job, as a woman, and a mother". It was a very leading-question interview, and I don't think the interviewer got what they were fishing/hoping for.

    This line stands out: "If what we have created is enough better than the last thing our customers had, then ship it." Um, OK :confused: That sounds really close to "If it's better than what we already were selling, and our customers already have, by just enough margin, go ahead and ship it", IMO.

    Meh... I'd rank the article as un-interesting, and very scope limited (intentionally, IMO). One of the most boring reads in recent memory, IMO.

    That aside, I'm grateful she works for TiVo. She's likely the ONLY reason I'm not always mad at TiVo, or feeling let-down by TiVo, on a daily basis, anymore. She's, IMO, the only decent and reliable source of news, support, and truthful disclosure of TiVo problems (which are TiVo's own problems), which the TiVo call center still usually proves either clueless about, or deliberately ignorant about, and a dead-end for resolution of them.

    I still think she should be in charge of creating a better mainstream support center solution for TiVo, and should pink-slip the current provider for their support call center.
     
  20. nooneuknow

    nooneuknow TiVo User Since 2007

    3,554
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    Feb 5, 2011
    Cox Cable...
    Just in case, rather than making assumptions on what/how you communicated...

    1. Did you provide the TSNs of your units in the email, and use the subject title she requested?

    2. Are you aware that she's nearly always flooded with TSNs to process, for an unknown number of issues, and may not have the time to reply to every email?

    I usually send my TSNs, and the specifics of the problem, making sure I put the subject she requests in as the email subject.

    If I don't see any improvement, or continue to have problems after a couple days, I do the follow up, using the same subject, again include TSNs, and politely note it is a follow-up to an unresolved problem.

    I also make sure I do anything she requests, like making service connections, rebooting manually, etc.

    Believe it, or not, I actually keep my emails to her short, to the point, and polite. It would be an assumption, that everybody understand her workload, and how she goes above, any beyond, her job title (and other things).
     

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