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Please Help! Tivo Keeps Restarting!

Discussion in 'TiVo Help Center' started by platinumkid222, Oct 29, 2007.

  1. Nov 27, 2007 #101 of 1060
    CrashHD

    CrashHD I am the me.

    757
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    Nov 10, 2006
    MO, USA
    Yes, but no. If the chance of each drive failing is 1 in 100, their chance of failure is the same, but the chance of both failing would be 1 in 10000 (1/100 * 1/100) (assuming their failures are independent of each other, i.e. they weren't ruined by some other effect (power surges, murphy's law, etc.) which coincidentally affected them both at the same time.


    rather than image the drives and see how long they run, why not put them in a pc and run a test that gives more definitive results (mfr. diagnostic, spinrite, etc). If the drives are going bad, just about any utility that can read the hdd SMART info will tell you more than just imaging and trying again.
     
  2. Nov 27, 2007 #102 of 1060
    Tivo II Jack

    Tivo II Jack New Member

    442
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    Aug 10, 2003
    "Welcome! Powering up..."

    Right now, the Twilight Zone theme should be playing. I was about to start a reboot to watch and answer your questions and decided to read your note again and at the exact instant that I clicked on the link above, the unit did its own reboot to show Screen: Welcome! Powering up...

    Both lights were yellow and as I watched, after a minute or so, there was one red light on the right. I hit pause and got two yellows so I hit 5 8 and within seconds I got the Screen: Installing a Service Update This will take a few minutes with no lights

    A minute or so later the Screen: Welcome! Powering up... returned with two yellows which in a minute or so became one red on right. I let it run and soon saw the Screen: Installing a Service Update This will take a few minutes with no lights.

    In Tivo Central there are no lights

    I see the Screen: Installing a Service Update This will take a few minutes. I am not certain, but I believe the last time I saw the Screen: Preparing the Service Update This may take up to an hour, possibly longer ---was when I first installed one of the working drives.

    I unplugged and waited a minute or so and plugged it in again. All changes happened in a minute or less unless specified.

    I got Screen: Welcome! Powering up... with two yellows that actually were a pale yellow on the left and an orangish yellow on the right.

    After about 2 minutes I got just a red on the right, then a yellow on the left, then no lights and then Screen: Almost there Just a few minutes more also with no lights.

    Next came Screen: Installing a Service Update This will take a few minutes again with no lights then 3 or 4 mintes later a blank screen. Normally, here is where the Tivo animated thing starts, but I waited 10 minutes while typing this and nothing changed until I hit the Tivo button.

    In Tivo central, all was the same. I do know that when I looked at the Connect to the Tivo service now screen it used to alternate. After a connection, I would see the pending restart message and after restarting again, would see last connection succeeded and those two messages would alternate after each restart. Now it always shows as Succeeded.

    I will put my next genius idea in the next note.
     
  3. Nov 27, 2007 #103 of 1060
    Tivo II Jack

    Tivo II Jack New Member

    442
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    Aug 10, 2003
    Remember I am playing with a Linux OS with a mind that is hard wired for windows. Here is my next great idea.:confused:

    I have the 80GB drive I removed from one box that is pretty much expendable. If I recaked that drive for the Toshiba with dual HD's and made that drive the master and the problem drive the slave, would I be able to do a restart and have the 9.1 software installed on that 80GB drive?

    I don't know how dual HD are connected, but it seems that one HD would have to be...I'm thinking...outside the box.:rolleyes:

    If that works, I am again...sheesh...assuming that to connect the two HD's I would use a ribbon cable with a slave connector and a power splitter. If I am right, would I then be able to copy the recordings from the now slave drive to the master.

    If that can't be done, my Tivo II S2 should now recognize the master and be able to MRV recordings from the slave drive in the Toshiba box to the Tivo box???

    Right now I am more confused than Vinnie Barbarino ever was.
     
  4. Nov 27, 2007 #104 of 1060
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
    2
    Jan 4, 2003
    Ha! Perhaps we should call Mr. Kotter!

    As far as the sequence you're gettting at start-up it all looks okay. The weak yellow, bright yellow lighting sounds normal and beyond that it's doing what it should. I can't recall, but I don't think the animated TiVo bit will run after KS58.

    The sticking point is that it's obviously trying to install the software, but isn't able to for whatever reason. Something is wrong there, but I've really no idea what it is other than that part of the disk is corrupted somehow.

    I don't think you can switch your "A" and "B" drives without re-writing everything. As with a PC, TiVo looks at the "A" drive on start-up and if everything it's looking for isn't there, no go.

    I'll see if Greg can answer your questions about re-imiging the drive(s). I've never used instant cake...always used the Linux boot disk and that was ages ago.

    My gut feeling is that you're going to need to pull the drive(s) and do a deep diagnostic (read/write/read) to find out if there's an issue. It may be that you'll need to get a fresh image and start anew as well. :(

    I think I've run out of ideas at this point but I'll keep checking in. Hopefully Greg will chime.

    Hang in there!
     
  5. Nov 27, 2007 #105 of 1060
    greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    6,384
    0
    May 21, 2004
    Slower...
    I've been here all day watching but nothing more to say. :)

    No you can not add a second drive and not reimage both and not loose everything.

    I still suggest running the Western Digital diagnostic on the drive. You don't have to loose data to do that. If the drive is at all salvageable, it will mark the bad sectors as bad so the tivo will stop using them.

    Ideally, you would just use one of those 500GB you bought and dd_rescue this bad drive to it. MRV everything off, then IC that 500GB a second time.
     
  6. Nov 27, 2007 #106 of 1060
    raddogz

    raddogz New Member

    9
    0
    Apr 25, 2002
    Interesting solutions. I am beginning to think bad power supply and will probably replace it soon.

    I can understand two drives failing, but a third unrelated drive failing seems odd unless Murphy's law says that third drive is bad too.

    I've changed ribbon cables as well and went from the y-power cable back to the original power cable to power the single hard drives - no dice.
     
  7. Nov 27, 2007 #107 of 1060
    greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    6,384
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    May 21, 2004
    Slower...
    Silly question, but are sure you have the proper version of IC for your Tivo?

    Lou (aka tivouprade) surely would know what the symptoms of using the wrong image would be. Seems doubtful it would have even booted.
     
  8. Nov 27, 2007 #108 of 1060
    Tivo II Jack

    Tivo II Jack New Member

    442
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    Aug 10, 2003
    I had to switch the HD's to record shows on the new drive and when booting up, I saw that the good drive followed the same sequence of screens and lights as the problem drive. Next time I switch them and during the Screen: Welcome! Powering up... I am going to wait for the double yellows to turn red and then hit pause and 5 8 and see if it runs that way.

    I will also try the WD diagnostic.
     
  9. Nov 27, 2007 #109 of 1060
    Tivo II Jack

    Tivo II Jack New Member

    442
    0
    Aug 10, 2003
    Since the drive is out of the unit right now, I will try the diagnostic route. I found a Maxtor/Seagate diagnostic that seems to do what the WD link you sent does.

    http://www.seagate.com/www/en-us/support/downloads/seatools/seatooldreg

    If you can take a look, is this an equivalent to the WD tool? It says it will work with any OS on the drive.
     
  10. Nov 27, 2007 #110 of 1060
    greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    6,384
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    May 21, 2004
    Slower...
    I have a Seagate drive in my PC. I downloaded the .iso and burned to a disc using imgburn.

    But didn't have any luck with this. It will boot to the CD and starts up and sees my seagate drive in the DOS GUI. But as soon as I touch the keyboard it dumps to a black DOS command prompt. :confused:

    Perhaps it just doesn't like my PC.

    The tools don't care what OS is on the drives. It is checking the disk itself, not its content.

    I am going to try the WD one right now and see if it works with my Seagate drive better than the Seagate one does. :rolleyes:
     
  11. Nov 27, 2007 #111 of 1060
    greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    6,384
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    May 21, 2004
    Slower...
    Bad news. The WD throws an error immediately and says NON WD DRIVES DETECTED or some such. :eek:
     
  12. Nov 27, 2007 #112 of 1060
    greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    6,384
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    May 21, 2004
    Slower...
  13. Nov 28, 2007 #113 of 1060
    Tivo II Jack

    Tivo II Jack New Member

    442
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    Aug 10, 2003
    I started to reply that I can't use that tool because my HD is only 120GB and the tool is only good for drives that are equal to or larger than 500...:eek: Oh, MB.

    It seems like only yesterday when I was still using my once very large 350MB HD when I ran into a friend who told me of his newest HD. It was a whole GB and I was in awe. It had to cost him at least $350.

    I have copied the Maxtor tool to a floppy and will run the diagnostic tomorrow. Thanks again Greg.
     
  14. Nov 28, 2007 #114 of 1060
    greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    6,384
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    May 21, 2004
    Slower...
    Actually, just so you know, you don't copy it to a floppy. You run it in Windows and it creates a floppy for you.

    I use that floppy at work occasionally to test suspect drives. I'll try to boot it up today so I am familiar again with the options.

    Here is a link to an CD .iso download of powermax if you prefer.
    http://digilander.libero.it/YorkOne/powermax/
     
  15. Nov 28, 2007 #115 of 1060
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
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    Jan 4, 2003
    I remember using Powermax years ago and it seemed to work fine, but I don't know how detailed the diagnostics are on it...seemed like it only ran basic surface scans.

    Glad things are progressing. :up:

    BTW, I vividly remember breaking out into a sweat when I bought a 250MB HDD for $275 once...biggest one on the market at the time. Sigh.
     
  16. Nov 28, 2007 #116 of 1060
    raddogz

    raddogz New Member

    9
    0
    Apr 25, 2002
    Yup, I checked and double checked. I will triple when I get home again though :D

    Actually, I just checked the service number and there is only one 1400 i.e 2g of Series 2.
     
  17. Nov 28, 2007 #117 of 1060
    greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    6,384
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    May 21, 2004
    Slower...
    Running Powermax right now on a 40GB Maxtor have lying around.

    There is a Basic scan and an Advanced scan. Don't think either repair anything like I've seen the WD one do. :( (I don't have bad drive to test against.)

    But it should settle once and for all if there really is a problem with your drive or not I would think.
     
  18. Nov 28, 2007 #118 of 1060
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
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    Jan 4, 2003
    I've hear a good hammer can remedy that. ;)
     
  19. Nov 28, 2007 #119 of 1060
    tivoupgrade

    tivoupgrade Sponsor

    2,494
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    Sep 27, 2000
    Chicago, IL...
    I stand corrected (and I had to read up to reacquaint on statistical indendence). The chances of each drive failing are the same; but significantly lower of both of them failing.

    With that said, my original recommendation was still to thoroughly test each drive - that is always the best approach. I know I sound like a broken record around here because I say it in every post I respond to, but for some reason there is a good deal of resistance to it.

    After reading through the rest of the thread, I can see why, though...
     
  20. Nov 28, 2007 #120 of 1060
    tivoupgrade

    tivoupgrade Sponsor

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    Sep 27, 2000
    Chicago, IL...
    From what I remember of Powermax, there is also a low-level format and in some cases, if a problem is detected, the application will ask you if you want to attempt to repair. I don't recommend that, though - if there are bad sectors on the disk, then its likely that more will form, so unless this is just for temporary reasons, I would not rely on a 'repaired' drive for very long, if at all.
     

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