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Overlapping recordings cause glitch?

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by tomhorsley, Dec 26, 2013.

  1. Feb 12, 2014 #61 of 112
    kbmb

    kbmb Active Member

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    Yes both.

    -Kevin
     
  2. Feb 12, 2014 #62 of 112
    tomhorsley

    tomhorsley Active Member

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    Yep. This was a feature I'd love to have had with my 2 tuner Premier, so naturally they finally get around to implementing it now that I have six tuners, and they screw it up.
     
  3. Feb 12, 2014 #63 of 112
    astrohip

    astrohip Well-Known Member TCF Club

    10,063
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    Houston &...
    You're wrong. No easy way to break it to you, you're just wrong. And don't bother to reply, because that'll be wrong too. Better to quit now, and save those unused CAPS and commas for a rainy day.

    QFT.
     
  4. Feb 12, 2014 #64 of 112
    mattack

    mattack Active Member

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    Maybe for you, but because I record a LOT of network shows on the same channel that need padding, it is *essentially* giving me more tuners, since those network shows that need padding are my highest priority shows (since they don't repeat during the week like cable shows).

    Maybe you're just nitpicking words, that's fine.. Again, I didn't say that it literally gave you more tuners, but this feature does (and would do it _well_ without the glitch) allow me to record more shows "at once" (I am including the overlap due to necessary padding) on the same hardware.
     
  5. Feb 12, 2014 #65 of 112
    mattack

    mattack Active Member

    20,743
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    Yeah, you said it better than I did. I bought my OLED S3 (dead) and Tivo HD during the lifetime transfer periods (I should have waited and got two Tivo HDs instead, since it would've been way cheaper).. got my P4 when the analogs were finally shut off around a year ago.. Then got my Roamio "for fun" within the past few months.

    I have way less need for more tuners nowadays (though I do keep intending to sell the P4 and I really should do it), so it's ironic that they add it now! But I do still see conflicts once in a RARE RARE while. So it may still be useful to me. (I have basically moved almost all SPs to the Roamio in preparation to selling the P4.. just need to actually download the shows off & do the ebay or whatever thing some eon.)
     
  6. Feb 12, 2014 #66 of 112
    ejonesss

    ejonesss New Member

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    anyone out there know of any non tivo boxes that can run tivo guide service or any hd tivos that are no longer supported even eol'd so they did not get that update?

    and i have plenty of caps and commas to waste.

    and when i run out of caps and commas i will get a new keyboard witch i have to do anyways since i have some sticky keys that dont register..

    one thing i am going to be saving is money now because since all the boxes seem to have the bug i will not upgrade to roamio.

    though i like the external power supply of the roamio base model since it is dc 12 volts thereby making it possible to run the dvr from a car battery that's another post subject
     
  7. Feb 12, 2014 #67 of 112
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

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    John's...
    mattack,

    Maybe we can agree on this - it removes one reason for needing additional tuners, but it doesn't eliminate it. I remember one year (maybe 2004?) where I needed all three of my single tuner TiVos and 2 VCRs to record the 8-9PM Friday time slot.

    ejonesss,

    No Series 3 (or earlier) TiVo will ever get this feature, so knock yourself out.



    As far as the problems with this go, the video "glitch" is a minor annoyance. IMHO, the scheduler problems are the true killer.
     
  8. Feb 13, 2014 #68 of 112
    ejonesss

    ejonesss New Member

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    what about manual recordings? if i set 2 overlapping manual recordings will the same glitch happen?

    i know the scheduler problems shouldnt happen since you are making them manual and it is impossible for the box to know since you are not queuing them from the listings.

    but i am not sure if manual recordings would solve the corruption of the stream since the box copies the data
     
  9. Feb 13, 2014 #69 of 112
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

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    John's...
    I doubt using manual recordings would change anything. Overlapping recordings on the same channel should be treated the same way regardless of how they are created. Of course, there is no way of knowing for sure w/o trying.

    "corruption of the stream"? Engage in hyperbole much? Looking at an affected recording in VideoRedo, the glitch lasts for 21 frames or @2/3 of a second.
     
  10. Feb 13, 2014 #70 of 112
    ejonesss

    ejonesss New Member

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    lpwcomp that is what i am talking the loss of data.

    i guess i could if there is going to be a marathon just record as 1 long 16 hour manual stream


    note to tivo: if you are not going to revoke the patch or give us back our tuner then for the love of god do the copying and splicing in the background so it does not cause the dropped frames
     
  11. Feb 13, 2014 #71 of 112
    PedjaR

    PedjaR Member

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    Exactly. This effectively forced me to remove a bunch of paddings that I would like to have.
     
  12. Feb 13, 2014 #72 of 112
    kbmb

    kbmb Active Member

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    Same here.....we no longer pad any shows until this is fixed. We've missed a couple shows in the past few weeks because of this issue.

    I hate missing that last punchline that networks love to have go over the time....but it's better than missing the whole show. At least we have the Xfinity VOD and can catch up, but it's painful with commercials :mad:

    -Kevin
     
  13. Feb 13, 2014 #73 of 112
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

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    John's...
    I've actually never seen the scheduler problem with a minute or 2 of overlap. I only saw it when I had overlap that included the entire second show. Note here that I am not saying that it doesn't happen, just that I have not personally experienced it.

    Once again I say fix it or pull it. Trying to implement some mechanism for a user to disable it, i.e. "kludge the kludge" is just silly, especially since it is unlikely to work as those requesting it would like.
     
  14. Feb 13, 2014 #74 of 112
    kbmb

    kbmb Active Member

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    That's what makes it frustrating.....with a short 2 minute overlap you never know you are missing a show until it's too late. I might record 3 shows in a row back to back and it will miss the second only.

    I went probably all of Dec and most of Jan without it happening, then it happened twice on back to back nights.

    -Kevin
     
  15. Feb 13, 2014 #75 of 112
    ejonesss

    ejonesss New Member

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    @kbmb that's the reason that the feature should be removed and the boxes go back to using both streams of the cable m card.

    for the conflicts if they are on the channel being recorded you can just pad one of the other shows longer to get that show.

    tivo folks you may want to reprimand the software developer employee who snuck that feature in without getting approval or extensive testing
     
  16. Mar 7, 2014 #76 of 112
    kunzman

    kunzman New Member

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    I've been experiencing a similar problem this week, but what I discovered is that it actually did record the second overlapping show, but the MPEG navigation data is corrupted.

    If you just let the program play, even though it only shows 1 minute of recording on the display, it will actually keep playing after that (but only after looping back to the beginning once). If you fast forward or rewind, it resets back to the beginning of the recording. While playing the show in this fashion, the playback progress bar is stuck at 0 minutes.

    For me, it's been doing this with the Daily Show and Colbert Report where the recording overlaps by 1 minute. The Colbert Report for the last few days has displayed as only having one recorded minute (green filled area) in the play bar, but the side summary info shows 31 minutes, and it will play as described above.
     
  17. Mar 7, 2014 #77 of 112
    L David Matheny

    L David Matheny Active Member

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    Your Daily Show is probably OK, but your Colbert Report has a signal problem. Some transport stream timing data (Program Clock Reference?) is missing or corrupted or not incrementing properly. TiVo uses that data for some trick play and other purposes. If it's garbled for the whole recording, the TiVo may even conclude that no time elapsed and therefore no video data was captured, and it will then discard the recording even though actually everything is there but the timing data. I have a local OTA station that has had that problem occasionally. The fact that you have one good minute of a different show at the beginning of your recording keeps the whole thing from being discarded when it ends.
     
  18. Mar 7, 2014 #78 of 112
    kunzman

    kunzman New Member

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    Correct, the Daily Show recording is always fine. I'm not sure if it uses streams like the old DVD MPEG streams, but those had separate navigation data sub streams that told you how far ahead to jump for x2, x4, etc. If those were corrupted, that would probably result in what I'm seeing.
     
  19. Mar 10, 2014 #79 of 112
    GmanTiVo

    GmanTiVo give me more options

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    Mar 8, 2003
    Ridgewood, NJ
    Hi there,

    Can someone confirm whetther a 1 or 2 minute "padding" on a Roamio Plus/Pro will cause the glitch to occur.

    I am looking to replace my Oled S3 and have VZ FIOS..... I have to pad almost every season pass in order to get the last min. of the program I am recording/watching, and many recorded shows are on the came channel back to back (Discovery, SciFi, etc.).

    Thank you very much!

    Gman
     
  20. Mar 10, 2014 #80 of 112
    kbmb

    kbmb Active Member

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    Generally, yes it will occur on back to back recordings on the same channel.

    -Kevin
     

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