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News on the pixelation issue fix for TiVo HD

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by GoldenTiger, Aug 5, 2007.

  1. Aug 8, 2007 #61 of 144
    bkdtv

    bkdtv New Member

    7,902
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    Jan 9, 2003
    DC Metro Area
    You've described exactly what I am seeing with FiOS in DC/VA.

    It's probably a driver issue. The TivoHD uses a number of relatively new drivers (for new hardware) so there are probably bugs to be worked out.
     
  2. Aug 8, 2007 #62 of 144
    GoHokies!

    GoHokies! O2->CO2 Converter

    2,657
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    Sep 21, 2005
    KFME
    My beef is that , when presented with the statement that signal strength could be causing people's pixelation problems you chose to very rudely state that there was no way that signal strength could cause someone's pixelation problems and came back with "I'm an engineer so I know what I'm talking about" when questioned on it instead of either a)ignoring the statement or b)politely stating that signal strength problems are not the case with the folks posting here like you. Your experience doesn't have anything to do with it (other than I would think that it would give you an appreciation for the fact that a problem can have more than one cause and not blindly assume that because your pixelation problem isn't caused by signal strength, than no one's pixelation problems are being caused by signal strenght issues).

    If I had read your post and taken your advice, I would be stuck waiting for a fix from Tivo that would never come. I was merely trying to save other people from that fate by reminding folks that checking signal strength is a perfectly valid troubleshooting step.

    The reason that the board is not filled with people saying that signal strength fixed their pixelation problem is that a) that's not real noteworthy and b)that fact is kind of off topic for this thread since your pixelation is caused by something else.
     
  3. Aug 8, 2007 #63 of 144
    jmpage2

    jmpage2 New Member

    1,951
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    Jan 20, 2004
    Well, this is the first post I made on the matter;

    If that's a "rude" comment then I'd like to see your explanation of telling people with technical backgrounds to shove things in their pieholes being a civil response. :rolleyes:

    All you had to do is say "signal strength fixed my problem" and that would have been fine. It seems as though you'd like other people to be models of courteous behavior even though you, yourself, run around braying like a jackass at anyone who doesn't agree with you.
     
  4. Aug 8, 2007 #64 of 144
    GoHokies!

    GoHokies! O2->CO2 Converter

    2,657
    0
    Sep 21, 2005
    KFME
    Belittleing and factually incorreect parts of your post highlighted for your convienence.

    You'll also note (if you actually read and understand my posts) that I didn't say I was a model of civility, I even went so far as to say that I could have been more polite. I also didn't get to that level until you tried to convince folks that you were right because you were an engineer and that there was no way that increasing signal strength has fixed anyone's pixelation problems (despite me saying that it had happened to me in a previous post that again, it appears you didn't read and comprehend). It isn't a matter of opinion or agreement like you're trying to make it out to be.

    Whatever, man, I'm done with this. You can go on thinking whatever you want about me and my posting style. I'm past the point of caring what random strangers on the internet think about me. :rolleyes:

    People, if you are seeing pixelation, at least check your signal strength - it may solve some of your problems.
     
  5. Aug 8, 2007 #65 of 144
    bmgoodman

    bmgoodman Member

    971
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    Dec 20, 2000
    Northern...
    Any chance that heat is contributing? Perhaps try leaving your Tivo off for most of a day and see if the macroblocking disappears, but returns once the Tivo is in operation for x hours.

    Just throwing in a SWAG for your consideration.
     
  6. Aug 8, 2007 #66 of 144
    bkdtv

    bkdtv New Member

    7,902
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    Jan 9, 2003
    DC Metro Area
    I've turned my thermostat down from 76 to 68 degrees and it had no effect.
     
  7. Aug 8, 2007 #67 of 144
    TiVotion

    TiVotion Early Adoptersaurus

    1,082
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    Dec 6, 2002
    Tampa, FL
    I thought about maybe heat being a possibility too, since I didn't see the problem all day, then suddenly it started and got more frequent in the evening. I thought maybe it was overheating too.

    But what makes me think it's probably not that is because I've had the TiVo HD set up and running for about a week before the installer showed up yesterday with the cablecards. Of course, this means I was only watching channels 2-49 without the cablecards, but during that week, I did NOT have the macroblocking issue. This was from watching the card-less TiVo for several hours each night.

    Now, I think I've read that people have seen the issue without cablecards, with OTA broadcasts. That would make me think that the issue isn't strictly cablecard related. But my HD box worked with no macroblocking whatsoever for a week before it got cablecards.

    The whole thing is bizarre.
     
  8. Aug 8, 2007 #68 of 144
    Chimpware

    Chimpware New Member

    334
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    Jan 30, 2002
    Nope, check the trobleshooting thread, I already tested this.
     
  9. Aug 8, 2007 #69 of 144
    jfstx

    jfstx New Member

    17
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    Aug 26, 2005
    no claims to fame here. But I have macro blocking on over the air without a tivo at all. So can it be an issue with signals being broadcast or other interferences???
     
  10. Aug 8, 2007 #70 of 144
    nick58b

    nick58b New Member

    8
    0
    Jul 28, 2007
    Santa...
    I've got macroblocking issues too, but at least my slot 2 CC works now. The issue appeared with the install of my cablecards. I was watching something recorded before the install and thinking the problem was gone, but then remembered it was recorded before the cards were inserted, so I strangely have recordings that work fine, then those that don't.

    Other observations are that macroblocking appears on channels from all ranges, although it's definitely heavier on some than on others. Analog/digital/HD doesn't seem to make a differences. No issues without the cablecards, no issues with my previous SA8300 dvr on the same drop. Same everything as the SA8300, I pretty much replaced it with the TivoHD. Cox verified signal strength on the drop when they were trying to fix slot2.

    Also, I'm using SA cablecards with a 2007 date. Hopefully this info is useful to someone (maybe at tivo :) ). After they fixed the slot2 issue with an update I'm hopeful they'll get this issue fixed quickly.
     
  11. Aug 8, 2007 #71 of 144
    d_anders

    d_anders Sr Legacy Member

    763
    0
    Oct 12, 2000
    Twin Cities...
    I don't get a lot of pixelation, but I do get it on my TiVo HD box from time to time.

    The fact that I see pixelation on both menus, and probably more frequently with viewing recordings or live suggests that it's either a core hardware issue (I hope not), or something that has to be fixed at the display driver level.

    Does anyone know whether TiVo uses video chips that are firmware upgradable, or have standard linux based video drivers...which would require a fix from the chip manufacturer, possibly?

    Since there is some indication that TiVo knows there is an issue and is trying to fix it, it would be good if they indicated what type of problem they're dealing with so we can better understand why a fix is going to take longer than just a simple bug fix update.
     
  12. Aug 8, 2007 #72 of 144
    bmgoodman

    bmgoodman Member

    971
    0
    Dec 20, 2000
    Northern...
    Is your Tivo out in the open? Or inside a cabinet? Reducing the ambient temperature may not help very much if the air flow to the unit is restricted. That's why I suggested leaving the Tivo unplugged for a number of hours so that it cools down to approximately room temperature. Plug it back in and see if the macroblocking continues or goes away for a number of hours.
     
  13. Aug 8, 2007 #73 of 144
    AZFXSTB

    AZFXSTB New Member

    4
    0
    Aug 4, 2007
    Same here, I have updated the Drive to a Sammy 500 and still see the same issues. This is a WAG but I think it has to do with processing the digi channels and decoding them from the cable card. If I understand the CC they are just the key the Tivo still has to uncode and display the programing. Even when you are in a menu the Tivo is still decoding the channel in the background so that is why i think you see it in a menu also..like I said this is a WAG so don't take this to heart
     
  14. Aug 8, 2007 #74 of 144
    Chimpware

    Chimpware New Member

    334
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    Jan 30, 2002
    Read the Troubleshooting thread, I saw the same issue with one of the Tivo videos today, which has nothing to do with the cable cards. My guess is something to do with MPEG decoding / CPU utilization.
     
  15. Aug 8, 2007 #75 of 144
    AZFXSTB

    AZFXSTB New Member

    4
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    Aug 4, 2007
    Correct me if I am wrong here but even when viewing a tivo video isnt the TIVO buffering live TV and in turn it is decoding the channel. I do agree it is a CPU Mpeg issue as well but the cable cards bring it out I nver saw i issue with this before the cards were installed
     
  16. Aug 8, 2007 #76 of 144
    TiVotion

    TiVotion Early Adoptersaurus

    1,082
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    Dec 6, 2002
    Tampa, FL
    I can say that as well - my HD box was up and running a week before the cards were installed and I watched it 2 - 3 hours nightly, sometimes more. No macroblocking issues on any channels before the cards were installed.
     
  17. Aug 10, 2007 #77 of 144
    GoldenTiger

    GoldenTiger Tivo Pony =)!

    90
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    Apr 10, 2002

    Mine was running for a few of days, with an upgraded drive for two days, before I had the cablecards installed, and same deal here... nothing macroblocked on channels until the cards were installed.
     
  18. Aug 11, 2007 #78 of 144
    megazone

    megazone Hardcore TiVo Geek

    3,302
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    Mar 3, 2002
    .worcester.m...
    Glad you liked it. ;-)
     
  19. Aug 12, 2007 #79 of 144
    JimboDunky

    JimboDunky Disenchanted User

    16
    0
    Mar 6, 2002
    CT
    (Also posted on megazone)...I’ve used TiVo since 2000. I bought a DirecTV Philips DSR6000 for $99 and have used it all the way up until 2 days ago, with 1 hard drive swap with weaknees. I NEVER had any issues with that box, and I bought it when it first came out. I played the waiting game with HD, and when Comcast recently bought out Adelphia in my area, and they offered me a deal I couldn’t refuse, I ran out and got the TiVo HD box. My cable installer came yesterday and was here for 5 hours, with a virtual deck of CableCARDs, all were SA PKM600’s. Only 1 worked. Then he left, and I go to watch ESPNHD and I get damn legos across my screen every 10-15 seconds. So now I’m supposed to hope that my TiVo gets an update because TiVo is working on it? I’m supposed to waste 5 hours on a Saturday watching the Comcast cable guy play blackjack with my TiVo HD, only to see it take 1 CableCARD out of 22 of them? TiVo is at fault here, they have brought a product to market which relies on CC’s to watch digital content. What kind of CC testing took place ahead of the TiVo HD release? After some choice reading of everyone’s horror stories about all of this, obviously not a whole heck of a lot of testing went into CC compatibility. Walked over to my neighbors house and took a look at his Comcast DVR with HD channels and no pixelization, host ID screens, nothing. He’s never had any issues with his DVR. I don’t have the kind of time to hope and wait that an issue is fixed, when it should have been addressed before releasing this thing. If TiVo can rewind the 5 hours I wasted yesterday, I’d keep the box. Glad I didn’t cancel DirecTV. Next Saturday will consist of me returning this thing and exchanging it for a DTV HD DVR. At least I know I’ll get something that works right out of the box.
     
  20. Aug 12, 2007 #80 of 144
    jmpage2

    jmpage2 New Member

    1,951
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    Jan 20, 2004
    Jimbo,

    While I can appreciate your frustration, not all of the blame lies with Tivo. Tivo is forced to provide content the only way that's feasibly possible which is the cable card spec mandated by the FCC over a decade ago.

    It's not Tivo's fault that cable companies hate Cable Cards. It's not Tivo's fault that the installers are morons. It's not Tivo's fault that they have faulty hardware and inept operators punching numbers into the computers.

    Cable is, for all intents and purposes, a monopoly. They don't like someone else playing in their sandbox even one little bit and they demonstrate that as much as possible.

    As far as the "beta" quality of the Tivo HD, I agree wholeheartedly that Tivo should be paying us to test this crap and wait on fixes to the problems. I can't believe that Tivo hasn't seen these issues in Beta test and couldn't have gotten many of them addressed if the product was delayed another 3-6 months.

    I think that the sad reality is that Tivo was scared of missing out on the lucrative holiday selling season and felt it was better to launch with the product in the state it is in today rather than miss the window and launch a more feature complete box next year.
     

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