1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

New type of in-Tivo ads

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by Leo Valiant, Nov 14, 2007.

  1. Nov 22, 2007 #81 of 276
    RoyK

    RoyK New Member

    2,935
    1
    Oct 22, 2004
    SW VA
    If you define success as managing to avoid closing their doors. I define it as continuously showing a profit - something that they are yet to do.
     
  2. Nov 22, 2007 #82 of 276
    fredct

    fredct New Member

    393
    0
    Nov 15, 2004
    NJ
    Slippery slope, more often than not, is a logical fallacy, requiring a great stretch of causation of events that in no way actually cause each other. Using a slippery slope argument is what people turn to when they don't have an actual event to point to thats unacceptable, and instead need to fear monger about what else it could (but probably won't) mean.

    Combining it with the straw man, it makes an effective fear tactic, but doesn't relate to reality in the slightest.

    1. A has occurred (or will or might occur); therefore
    2. B will inevitably happen. (slippery slope)
    3. B is wrong; therefore
    4. A is wrong. (straw man)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope#The_slippery_slope_as_fallacy

    Next time you find yourself referring to a slippery slope, step back and realize you're probably wrong, if that's the best logic you can come up with.
     
  3. Nov 22, 2007 #83 of 276
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,900
    4
    Jan 4, 2003
    That was quite good and could be applied to a lot of what's going on in the world these days. TiVo ads are not a matter of life and death…or even a paper cut.

    Nice dose of reality. Thanks! :up:
     
  4. Nov 22, 2007 #84 of 276
    Leo Valiant

    Leo Valiant Member

    269
    0
    Apr 19, 2000
    Fresno, CA
    You can ignore street billboards too, but they still are an eyesore to the landscape. Some places pass laws against putting them up.

    This thread is focusing on the banner ad, but the ad tone alert is pretty annoying. I would say it's obtrusive. You're purposely trying to ignore the ads and TiVo is going "I will not be ignored" Bleep-Bleep-Bleep. It sounds like a voicemail/SMS alert on a cell.
     
  5. Nov 22, 2007 #85 of 276
    astrohip

    astrohip Well-Known Member TCF Club

    10,469
    233
    Jan 6, 2003
    Houston &...
    Smartest thing either of us has said yet. Well put, and thanks! :up:
     
  6. Nov 22, 2007 #86 of 276
    qunewsguy

    qunewsguy Member

    30
    0
    Sep 19, 2006
    Here's the thing, has Tivo ever promised specifically that you're paying for their product in order to skip advertisements altogether? Not that I can recall. Your monthly fee goes towards the guide data and extra features Tivo provides. The ability to skip commercials just comes with the territory. If they need to add additional revenue by putting small ads in the interface that's fine. It's still wayyyyy better than sitting through 15 minutes of commercials in a TV show.

    Just as long as they don't force us to sit through entire programs and commercials without the fast forward feature available. I can picture it now, the Tivo Series 4, now with the peanut remote sans a fast forward button. Now THAT would be a slippery slope. :)
     
  7. Nov 22, 2007 #87 of 276
    Phantom Gremlin

    Phantom Gremlin New Member

    1,555
    0
    Jun 20, 2002
    Tualatin,...
    Here's what TiVo Central looks like on my TiVo HD right now:

    Now Playing List
    Watch Live TV
    Find Programs
    Music, Photos, Products, & More
    Showcases & TV Guide
    Messages & Settings
    TM Thanksgiving Break Movie Specials!
    * Sneak a peek at the new Jaguar XF


    The TM above is a "TiVo man" symbol. The * above is a five pointed yellow star.

    I would classify both bottom lines as ads. And yes, I have a picture.

    And, yes, this is a PITA. Whenever I want to turn off my TiVo I must go to Messages & Settings. It just became even more difficult to turn the box off.
     
  8. Nov 23, 2007 #88 of 276
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,900
    4
    Jan 4, 2003
    We're seeing the same thing. But I guess I'd still say...so what? An ad for Unbox videos and an ad for a Jag. Big deal. We took a look at the movie specials and even checked out the ad for the car...but no one broke our fingers making us push the remote buttons to get there...could have just as easily ignored them.

    In the six plus years we've had TiVo we've never turned any of them off. I know there must be a valid reason. :confused:

    Why? The Messages and Settings line is in exactly the same place as it's always been on the TiVo Central menu. Even if that changed, pushing a little button one or two times more is a PIA? But it’s not a PIA to sit down at a computer and write a detailed post complaining about it? How many keystrokes and time does that take?

    I guess some of us have a very low pain threshold or different ideas of what constitutes discomfort when it comes to our posteriors. ;)
     
  9. Nov 23, 2007 #89 of 276
    Phantom Gremlin

    Phantom Gremlin New Member

    1,555
    0
    Jun 20, 2002
    Tualatin,...
    Simple explanation: not everyone's home viewing environment matches yours.

    On my series 1 it didn't matter because the box always buffered live TV anyway. On my DirecTiVos it matters a lot because the boxes stop buffering when off. Which means much less wear and tear on the crappy consumer grade hard drives. Offhand I don't know what the default is for TiVo HD but why should I have to think so hard about whether or not a TiVo needs to be turned off. I have three TiVos going to the A/V receiver, two are DirecTiVos, one is a TiVo HD. Why should they be running their hard drives if I'm not watching or recording?

    We turn our TV on and off during the day. But we just leave the A/V receiver on all day because it takes much less power than a TV and it's just one less switch to turn on and off. However, if we leave the A/V receiver and a TiVo on, then we have (annoying) sound from the speakers even without the TV on.

    Yes it is a PITA. I can turn off a DirecTiVo from the front panel without viewing the TV. I can even turn it off "blind" by hitting:
    TiVo
    then Page Down
    then Select. (standby function)

    But it's much more complicated to turn off a TiVo HD:
    TiVo
    then Page Down
    then arrow up (move up from ad)
    then Select (messages and settings)
    then Page Down
    then Select (standby function)

    OOPS! That doesn't work anymore because now there are a variable number of lines of ads and not one. So instead the sequence becomes:
    Tivo
    then arrow down
    then arrow down
    then arrow down
    then arrow down
    then arrow down
    then select (messages and settings)
    then Page Down
    then select (standby function)

    Simple, huh? NOT!!! Rube Goldberg would be proud of TiVo's idea of an "off" switch, which isn't an "off" switch anyway!

    The really sad thing is that some marketing pukes at TiVo thought it was a good idea to sell their souls to Satan for some extra coin, and in doing so to ridiculously complicate what used to be a relatively common and relatively simple thing for me to do.

    A total of 9 button presses of 4 different buttons just to put the box into standby.

    I'm sure I'm not the only one who is inconvenienced by this, I'm just more likely to complain than most.
     
  10. Nov 23, 2007 #90 of 276
    bicker

    bicker bUU

    10,419
    47
    Nov 9, 2003
    Georgia
    Who are you talking about? Comcast is doing GREAT! (Did you ever READ the message you replied to? :confused: )
     
  11. Nov 23, 2007 #91 of 276
    bicker

    bicker bUU

    10,419
    47
    Nov 9, 2003
    Georgia
    You would be wrong. The second-to-last is an entry point for Amazon Unbox, a TiVo special service.
     
  12. Nov 23, 2007 #92 of 276
    RoyK

    RoyK New Member

    2,935
    1
    Oct 22, 2004
    SW VA
    I was referring to TiVo.
    (Did you ever READ the message you replied to? :confused: )
     
  13. Nov 23, 2007 #93 of 276
    RoyK

    RoyK New Member

    2,935
    1
    Oct 22, 2004
    SW VA
    And you would be wrong. Amazon Unbox, while some may enjoy it and find it useful, is a commercial enterprise and this is a promotion for it -- an ad.
     
  14. Nov 23, 2007 #94 of 276
    bicker

    bicker bUU

    10,419
    47
    Nov 9, 2003
    Georgia
    I sure did read the message, and all you've confirmed is that either you didn't read, or didn't understand, my earlier message.

    Read it again. Ask questions if you don't understand.
     
  15. Nov 23, 2007 #95 of 276
    gonzotek

    gonzotek tivo_xml developer

    2,416
    7
    Sep 24, 2004
    Outside...
    Phantom Gremlin: This is not the first time 2 ads have appeared on the TiVo Central Screen. As long ago as three years there were two separate lines for ad content on my S2 240 and 540, AND they weren't right next to one another at the bottom; one ad was placed between two regular menu items and the other was in the usual bottom position. These would be in addition to the Showcases area.

    Also, there is a TiVo remote command which you can program into a universal remote to enable a single-button standby Alternatively, you can start a previously recorded program and pause it, then just switch off the television. S3s(I believe, I don't own one to verify) and Standalone S2s spin their drives even in standby so it's no real advantage to standby over pausing the video, unless the lights are a distraction as well.
     
  16. Nov 23, 2007 #96 of 276
    pdhenry

    pdhenry Now 10% off

    18,146
    287
    Feb 27, 2005
    PA
    Hopefully you'll soon figure out that it's many fewer button pushes just to turn of your A/V receiver and not worry about turning off your TiVo. But feel free to complain all you want.
     
  17. Nov 23, 2007 #97 of 276
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,900
    4
    Jan 4, 2003
    Ah, that makes a bit of sense now...thanks for clarifying. For some reason I thought I remembered you saying in previous posts that you were using Comcast (exclusively) like we are across town. Didn't realize you had DirecTV as well.

    With regard to hard drives; I'm from the camp that believes there is a great deal more stress involved when they are turned on and off than if just left on all of the time. A majority of HDD's fail during startup. When you turn a hard drive on there is a surge of electricity that push platter spinup to speeds of as much as 10,000 rpm. It will then begin to warm up and reach an optimum operating temperature. The platters will begin to spin at the required speed and the the cooling fan will keep it at an appropriate temperature.

    When you turn the drive off the platters spin down, the read/write heads park and the hard drive cools down. Depending on the situation, temperature swings (called “thermal cycling”) and voltage surges when powering on may reduce the life of a hard drive when shutting them down regularly. It's not the green thing to do, but for longevity hard drives last longer when left alone. YMMV.

    I guess we've been lucky never having had a hard drive failure in all of these years. Knock on wood. *touching head*

    IIRC, the HDD's in S3's and THD's continue to spin 24/7 even in standby mode, so I don't think you're accomplishing your goal by "turning it off" except that you don’t hear the output because you have your receiver on. Might be better to just turn the receiver off?

    Hopefully gonzotek's earlier suggestions can eliminate that issue.

    I'm sure you're not alone.
     
  18. Nov 23, 2007 #98 of 276
    wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Ziphead

    10,440
    55
    Aug 2, 2003
    There are at least two advantages to using Standby on an S3:

    1. Less power usage -- maybe not a huge difference, but it's still there.

    2. Recordings are not interrupted by the Emergency Alert System force-tuning a different channel. This is a big deal when you have a system that does tests every night, like mine.

    I have the discrete code for Standby programmed to the Power key on my URC-6131 remote. (It also works as "LiveTV" when the Tivo is already in Standby.)
     
  19. Nov 23, 2007 #99 of 276
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,900
    4
    Jan 4, 2003
    Understood about #1...but is that actually true if the HDD doesn't spin down, etc.?

    Interesting about #2. They don't do that here, but from what I've read on the forum it's a real nuisance.
     
  20. pdhenry

    pdhenry Now 10% off

    18,146
    287
    Feb 27, 2005
    PA
    Urban legend. Oh, you mean you're not moving the read head around?
     

Share This Page