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NEW TiVo Search

Discussion in 'TiVo Search Feedback - Beta Release (Archive)' started by davezatz, Jan 7, 2009.

  1. Mr Flippant

    Mr Flippant Regular User

    642
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    Jan 2, 2009
    Well tonight I needed to do a search. My first reaction of course is to go search by title. Ibstead I went and used the new search. I then realized it was much slower than the current search and in the long run I will use the faster one more often. It would be great to speed this up.
     
  2. spacelysprockets

    spacelysprockets New Member

    1
    0
    Jan 8, 2009
    I love the interface, I absolutely hate the slowness. It is unbearably, unusably slow for me.

    35 seconds from the menu to the search.
    Type in "UNI" then wait 18 seconds before it will accept movement for "T"

    Tried it again a few minutes later, same result.

    TiVo is hardwired, and internet speed is 6mbps.

    If this can be RELIABLY and CONSISTENTLY as fast as the normal search, it's an absolute, total winner.

    If the speed doesn't improve substantially, it's an abomination.
     
  3. nrc

    nrc Cracker Soul

    2,458
    0
    Nov 17, 1999
    Living in a...
    When I tried it in the early morning hours the interface seemed very responsive. This evening it was just absolutely unusable. I understand TiVo's reasoning for the remote application approach, but particularly for text input it's really kills the experience.

    The problem is that even if you improve it, the nature of the net is going to inject random latencies that are going to make experience less than ideal. This is why technologies like Flash are popular for highly interactive web pages even though it's absolutely contrary to many other web best practices.

    At a minimum TiVo needs to find a way to handle the text entry part locally. Waiting for the response to a cursor input when you're selecting characters is absolutely maddening.
     
  4. wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Ziphead

    10,365
    22
    Aug 2, 2003
    I'd suggest getting a better network connection, because HME is not likely to change.
     
  5. nrc

    nrc Cracker Soul

    2,458
    0
    Nov 17, 1999
    Living in a...
    I have 8Mbs which is well above average for the U.S. If Tivo can't provide satisfactory performance for most of it's users then this feature isn't going to have much impact other than to create frustration.
     
  6. NotVeryWitty

    NotVeryWitty Too Big to Fail

    764
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    Oct 3, 2003
    Central Mass.
    If Tivo takes this attitude, this is doomed to fail. :eek:
     
  7. turbobozz

    turbobozz New Member

    211
    0
    Sep 21, 2006
    MD/VA
    ++

    HME apps are too slow for primary interface tools.
    Also I detest the keypad text entry... especially when hitting left arrow one too many laggy times bumps you back out of the tool/UI/app you are using.
    (Severely annoying to me.)

    TiVo needs to fix these (at least in future products) for their UI to remain viable and competitive.
     
  8. dmbpj

    dmbpj New Member

    69
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    Dec 29, 2008
    I feel the same. I also have a fast connection.


    I tried it this morning and it whizzed around at 7am. In primetime it was unusable and frustrating.
     
  9. wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Ziphead

    10,365
    22
    Aug 2, 2003
    Latency is the key here, not bandwidth.

    I'm not TiVo, but I have some knowledge of HME, and I can tell you -- it's easy to say "At a minimum TiVo needs to find a way to handle the text entry part locally," but how would you fit that in to the existing scheme of HME? Well, the answer is that you wouldn't. HME just doesn't work that way. It would be too high-level a construct.

    Of course TiVo could replace (or supplement) HME with some new system that did more work on the TiVo side. Don't hold your breath.
     
  10. Iluvatar

    Iluvatar New Member

    377
    0
    Jul 22, 2006
    Understandable, but considering the direction TiVo is going with these new HME apps I think it would be a wise decision to develop a next-gen HME framework with these types of issues in mind.
     
  11. turbobozz

    turbobozz New Member

    211
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    Sep 21, 2006
    MD/VA
    Like client side text entry widgets and some other client side UI stuff so that the TiVo doesn't have to wait for a server response to update the UI for *every* click.
    (I'm assuming that's how HME's work now.)
     
  12. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

    25,527
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    Jan 2, 2004
    Bear in mind we do not have a road map of where this is all going. TiVoPony has that but has opted not to publicly post it for any competitors.:)

    However some speculation on this is fairly straightforward.
    This HME app is a BETA and by using HME TiVo can take in feedback and make changes that we would all see on our TiVo DVRs tomorrow with no need to push out an update. Use of HME allows them to do a large open BETA and not break boxes or have long turnarounds.
    HME was not necessarily chosen in itself as the final form of this. I think for the Series 3 HME is the final form but the in design series 4 will very likely be more Java based as it will need to run OCAP in a sandbox for tru2way to begin with.
    So what is learned from adding in the HME TiVo Search adn getting the open BETA feedback from a significant base of users can be pulled into the UI design for the series 4 almost directly. This search for media to watch right away is at the heart of how a next generation Media Server should base all its functions around. The series 4 should not be your daddy's DVR but something much more.

    as for interaction with a back end server for data and graphics and to hook up to the media downloads, well a connected living room is just that. there really is no way to make a useful media search tool that resides mainly in the DVR without giving that DVR the power and the cost of a PC to sort and catagorize things.


    I can recall patiently doing things on the internet with a 56K BAUD modem and literally watching the web page draw itself as it took 20 seconds to load a simple text and some graphics. People would see me doing that and go, Man how you can deal with that. I smiled and said someday we will have big ISDN pipes or cable company big pipe and this will all go a lot faster and more people will use it. IPTV is kind of at that analog modem stage where simple content is very useable and more detailed content is there for adapters who are willing top deal with the limitations.

    So I suspect TiVo will do the balance act - after all no one HAS to use TiVo Search on the series 3, and be ready for the next big thing as the hardware and bandwidth allow for it to go mainstream and move from users who put up with BAUD modems to users who only want snappy web pages over a cable modem.
     
  13. mchief

    mchief Morey

    334
    1
    Sep 10, 2005
    Alexandria, VA
    CEO Rogers was on CNBC this afternoon talking about the great new search.
     
  14. bkdtv

    bkdtv New Member

    7,902
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    Jan 9, 2003
    DC Metro Area
    Quoted for emphasis.
     
  15. wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Ziphead

    10,365
    22
    Aug 2, 2003
    Noob. In my day, we had *300* bps modems, no graphics, and no Internet -- just local BBSes and $ervice$ like Compu$erve. The text came in at reading speed. And we liked it! :D
     
  16. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

    25,527
    0
    Jan 2, 2004
    well I left off the really hoary stuff ;) Though for me I waited for per month Internet versus by the hour so I joined in at 1200 baud Prodigy :eek: - but I did not want to scare the young folk with scary stories.
     
  17. kiko

    kiko New Member

    17
    0
    Jun 27, 2005
    I tried it last night here in Honolulu, and it was so painfull, even after waiting 10 minutes for the main screen, and then every key was at least another minute. My Internet is DSL 11Mb not shabby as dsl goes.

    Even trying to get back to any other screen was more than 2 minutes.
     
  18. MickeS

    MickeS New Member

    25,884
    0
    Dec 26, 2002
    AZ
    I tried it tonight, and again it took 4-5 tried to get the app launched.

    However, once it launched there was ZERO lag - everything ran as if it was the regular TiVo interface. And I only have 256k op /1.5M down Internet. :)

    It did however lock up on me. I searched for "CH" for American Chopper, went to the program info screen and selected "Record Next Episode", and then I got the "Please Wait" indicator, for like 2 minutes. I clicked on the TiVo button and left the search app, and checked my To Do list. The show was scheduled to be recorded as I had requested.

    Also, "Record Next Episode" seemed like a weird wording. There were 2 shows listed, one 1/10 and one 1/17. The one I selected to record was the 1/17 one. To call that "Record Next Episode" seems odd. Shouldn't it be "Record this episode" at that time? I could se using "Record Next Episode" as the label if you're on the main program description screen, but when selecting an individual episode, it should say "this" instead... IMO. :)

    I LOVE that the search is not alphabetical by default, but instead goes by "best match/most popular" or whatever it's called. Makes much more sense.

    It was a little weird though for search settings to be accessed by pressing the "Clear" button.
     
  19. dmbpj

    dmbpj New Member

    69
    0
    Dec 29, 2008
    this search is terrible
     
  20. bkdtv

    bkdtv New Member

    7,902
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    Jan 9, 2003
    DC Metro Area
    Could you be more specific? Give TiVo something to go on so they can improve it.
     

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