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Discussion in 'TiVo Upgrade Center' started by ciper, Jan 21, 2009.
Chipset is most likely JMicron
Looks like I spoke too soon. This drive/adapter combo did not end up working out.
The Tivo would work, but started freezing up on a daily basis, requiring a reboot to get it going again. Also, playback would be stuttering/jittery from time to time.
I took the drive out and ran Seagate's SeaTools drive test. I ran the long test both with the SATA to IDE adapter in place and without the adapter in place (SATA direct to the PC), the drive passed both tests.
I since put the old original drive back in and it's working fine. I guess I'll chalk it up to an incompatible drive.
This is just a guess on my part, but maybe the drive is too new for an S2, not because of SATA, but because of "Advanced Format" 4K sector instead of 512byte sector issues or/and problems negotiating down from 6Gb/s to whatever the combination of the adapter (designed when SATA drives were 1.5Gb/s, I suspect) and the IDE controller can handle.
If you could find a lightly used WD10EADS (Caviar Green, don't forget to run wdidle3 to disable Intellipark) or EALS (Caviar Blue), you might be alright, but be sure to check the label to make sure it's not a newer version with the same model number but switched to 4K sectors.
I'm running Caviar Blacks (FALS) in my S2 DTs ('cause they were on sale a couple or 3 Black Fridays ago), but with an extra fan in there as well, 'cause they're 7200RPM and get toasty.
4K sectors aren't really necessary until the drive is over 2TB in size, so the insistence of the industry to make it universal no matter how small the drive is really annoying, especially since they do their best to keep you from being able to find out which model number has what specs and if they've changed the specs without changing the model number.
One other thing, check on the power supply's capacitors.
The DT seems to have escaped the problems the single tuner S2s and all 3 versions of the S3 have had with capacitor plague, but that doesn't make it impossible for it to suffer from it as well.
I am ready to order the adapter from wowparts.com to go in my S2 with a SATA drive.
Do I also need to order a separate SATA power cable that will connect to the drive?
On the IDE side the adapter has the 40 pin data connector to which the Tivo's IDE ribbon cable connects and the 4 pin power connector into which the TiVo's 4 pin power plug is inserted (these are called Molex connectors after the original brand name---the little 4 plug things that floppy drives use are called Berg connectors).
On the SATA side of the adapter is a combination plug which simultanously plugs into both the data and power connectors of the SATA drive.
The adapter makes the SATA drive appear both electronically and physically to be a PATA/IDE drive, so if you have everything needed to connect a PATA drive (which the TiVo does), then you're covered.
Did it work?: No
TiVo Model: Series 1 Philips PVT300
Hard drive model: Western Digital WD10EURS
Adapter retail name: Addonics ADST1062-00B (ADSAIDE)
Chipset on the adapter: Marvell 88SA8052
Extremely frustrated here. I've done a number of upgrades on Series 2 units with similar WD drives and older Addonics adapters. Never a problem. I've tried numerous times with this combination on the S1, and I've even used the older Addonics adapters, different cables, etc. I tried the WDIDLE3 adjustment, and using a jumper on Pins 7 & 8 to enable (or disable?) the so-called "Advanced" mode of the drive. I had a similar problem in the past using a similar drive and an older Addonics using both WINMFS and the Linux version. Using the same tools, I was able to copy to another IDE drive, so I'm doing the software bit correctly.
Kick-start codes don't do anything -- it's as if the unit doesn't even know there's a drive connected (it shows the "Your Recorder is starting up ..." screen for a minute, resets, and then shows it again -- same thing if I simply disconnect the drive.
I'm beginning to think that this old Philips version simply cannot handle an upgrade with an SATA drive.
Any help would be immensely appreciated.
The S1 can run SATA drives (with a Marvell chipset adapter), but perhaps not that new a SATA drive, especially if it's a 4K sector drive, maybe.
It can't run a Caviar Blue, PATA or SATA, for some reason, and I had a pair of PATA Seagate 160GB drives which it would only accept one of at a time, although either could be the A or B drive along with some other brand/model no problem.
S1's are just finicky when it comes to hard drives.
Did it work?: Yes
TiVo Model: TCD540140
Hard drive model: Seagate ST96812AS 250GB 2.5"
Adapter retail name: WLXKJ-863B printed on board
Purchased from / Price: Two of them, both from eBay seller ibrookauction: one purchased 08/09 for $5.99 and one purchased earlier this month for $4.62
Chipset on the adapter: both Jmicron JM20330
The TiVo had been sitting dead for a long time, and recent competing recording conflicts with my wife on the craptacular Comcast box coupled with reviving my computer repair side business made me decide to revive the TiVo as well. I acquired a couple drives, the first one being an old Maxtor MAXLine Plus II 250GB 3.5" IDE drive, used InstantCake, got it up, running and up to date, but it is a ridiculously noisy drive. The other drive is a Toshiba MK2561GSYN 250GB 2.5" SATA drive I pulled from an old laptop. I didn't see anything saying a 2.5" drive couldn't be used, so I bought some brackets to put it in the TiVo. I used WinMFS to copy the Maxtor down to the Toshiba, put it in the Tivo, and it stuck at the "Welcome! Powering Up..." screen. I tried FixBoot Option 2 (I read a couple posts about people having success with Option 2, and none with Option 1, although I may try it here shortly) to no avail. Just to make sure it wasn't WinMFS, I used InstantCake on the Toshiba and it's still stuck at Powering Up. The worst part is I just returned a Rosewill RC-A-SATA-IDE adapter because I was about to use it in a machine I built to do hard drive cloning (the eBay ones refused to be a Master drive with an IDE Slave attached, only a Master by itself or the Slave...the Rosewill didn't have this issue), but then I acquired a better desktop with SATA connectors on the motherboard, so my cheapness wanted the ~$10 back (after the restocking fee and cost to mail it back).
So that's the back story. Anything else I should try, is this a possible issue with the 2.5" drive, or do I just need to reorder the Rosewill (or some other Marvell chip unit)?
EDIT: I got it working with a smaller sized (60GB) 2.5" drive.
The TiVo boots from partitions 2, 3, and 4.
Except for when it boots from partitions 5, 6, and 7.
Option 1 of FixBoot creates the first condition, option 2 creates the second.
The idea is to boot from whichever works.
The reason for 2 is that while it's running it can download an operating system update and then in the middle of the night it can rewrite it's bootpage, which is what options 1 and 2 do, and reboot itself, and when it does the bootpage rewrite will cause it to boot from the trio with the newest version of the software.
In WinMFS one can click on mfsinfo and somewhere in there it'll tell you which from which 3 the drive is currently set to boot.
Like I say, the idea is that if the current one isn't working, you try the other. You can alway go back and undo it.
Cool, thanks for the info. I'm currently bringing the Maxtor image back down to the Toshiba, so I'll try it then. But you don't see any issue with using a 2.5" drive right? I'm starting to suspect I have one of those Series 2 units that doesn't like the JMicron chip...
I have no experience with running a laptop drive in a TiVo, but I'm running a JMicron chipset in a 540, a 240, and 2 649s quite successfully.
I figured I'd give an update on my hard drive saga. I reordered the Rosewill adapter, and it still didn't work, so I started throwing every unused (and thanks to Ghost, some in use) SATA drive in my possession at it. Two hard drives worked, with both the JMicron and the Marvell chipsets:
Seagate ST3120813AS (120GB, 7200 RPM, 3.5" drive)
Seagate ST96812AS (60GB, 5400 RPM, 2.5" drive)
Three drives would not get past the Powering Up screen:
Toshiba MK2561GSYN (250GB, 7200 RPM, 2.5" drive)
Western Digital WD2500BEVS (250GB, 5400 RPM, 2.5" drive)
Western Digital WD5000BPVT (500GB, 5400 RPM, 2.5" drive)
The 120GB Seagate seemed to get way too hot, so I'm currently running the 60GB Seagate. If I get more bored, I'll try to figure out why the other 2.5" drives didn't work. I'll update my first post, and thanks for the help!
If this has been posted already feel free to delete
Did it work?: need to find a hr10-250 image to try it (will update after testing)
TiVo Model: hr10-250
Hard drive model: ST3802110A
Adapter retail name: Sata HDD to IDE
Purchased from / Price: centrix-intl part number PSTAD for $6.50 ea
Chipset on the adapter:
I think the chipset is correct but not sure.
I looked at the adapter and there is a jumper on the circuit board and i see at least 2 different ways it the jumper was pre-installed, also there are no instructions
there are 4 jumper pins on this adapter
I have seen the jumper across 3-4 and 2-4 in the packaging
That SunPlus may work on the PC but not the TiVo.
There has been extremely limited success and plentiful failure reported for them.
After some time experimenting I found a setup using components currently available on the market (July 2013) that allows the upgrade of Series1 Philips (HDR212) with SATA drives.
Did it work?: YES
TiVo Model: HDR212
Hard drive model: Hitachi Deskstar HDP725050GLA360, 500GD/7200rpm/SATA 3GB/s, purchased at www.geeks.com
Adapter retail name: "IDE to SATA Bidirectional Hard Drive Converter/Adapter"
Purchased from / Price: http://www.ebay.com/itm/370339747527 seller: redtagtown Price: $5
Chipset on the adapter: unknown, see pictures below
My own pictures of the adapter (10Mpix, not resized)
If someone can figure out the chipset please let me know.
Hm I tried to edit again the post above but for some reason I can't.
Anyway. The 3rd picture is where the markings on the chip show the best. Still it doesn't tell me who makes it. It looks like the ebay picture has a bigger chip with different markings, but it's too low resolution. There currently are many sellers on ebay offering what appears to be (from the pictures) this same model of adapter for prices between $4 and $8 - I chose this particular seller because he ships from the US as opposed to China, thus fast delivery.
As for procedure: I prepared the drive by restoring one of my own backups using the mfslive boot CD, then plugged the adapter directly in the connector on the Tivo motherboard (after removing the IDE cable - this makes a dual-drive setup impossible, or at least hard), connected the drive to the adapter, plugged both the drive and the adapter into the power connectors (the adapter needs separate power) then powered up the Tivo. Tested the setup by making a daily call, recording a program and then playing it back. Everything works as expected.
Investigating further to find out the chipset: I found the following image from another ebay seller; the adapter looks physically almost identical, but has a model number stenciled.
Googling the model number YT-JM330 I found:
1. Amazon sells one for a few cents less; looks very close, down to the round clamshell packaging. http://www.amazon.com/IDE-SATA-Adapter/dp/B000RK89M4
2. A link to JMicron http://www.jmicron.com/Product_JMB363.htm - perhaps this is the chipset?
3. link to a Russian store that sells a similar product except the PCB is red; the image is slightly better resolution and shows a Sunplus SATALINK SPIF223A chip.
However, looking at PCB details it appears that the adapters are only superficially similar, but the PCB layout of components is different for all of the above.
At this point I have no idea what the chipset is. For good measure I ordered a few more from the same seller.
Why the SATA red cable ? without SATA power cable I would think one would just plug the SATA drive into the card and not need this red cable.
You can't. For one thing the connector on the card is male, same as on the drive. Then the other connectors (power and the other SATA connector, which is used for the reverse conversion IDE-drive-to-SATA-motherboard) would get in the way. You have to use the cable. Plus you need to plug a separate power cable into the drive.
The adapters that I have used plug directly into a SATA drive (and use double sided stick tape to hold them to the drive) and make the drive look like a PATA drive, you then just plug in the PATA cable and power and are good to go, good for Series 2 disk changes.
I guess your talking the other direction.
This adapter is made to plug in the motherboard, and connect to the drive with a SATA cable (which replaces the IDE cable). It effectively transforms the motherboard's IDE port into a SATA port.