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How to stop Live TV recording?

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by MojoB, Jul 20, 2012.

  1. lrhorer

    lrhorer Active Member

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    Aug 31, 2003
    San...
    Use a virus scanner. Dozens of people on this site can testify the official distribution of WinMFS from http://www.mfslive.org is virus free. If you really have a bug up your butt about it, use MFS_Live. It's a linux distro on a live CD. Linux does not have viruses.

    Then re-load from your backups.

    WinMFS won't screw up your computer settings.

    Extremely poorly. Not at all if you have a LAN server. Or a decent OS.

    The MAK allows TDT to log in and download information and files from the TiVo.

    I suppose you could, but that would pretty much defeat the primary purpose of the MAK. That, plus the previous owner should never really share his MAK with you, or anyone else. Neither should you. A much better solution is to call TiVo and have the new TiVo transferred to your account, at which point in time (well, within 48 hours) it will obtain the same MAK as the other TiVo on your account. Note the MAK doesn't really have anything directly to do with TDT, per se. The MAK is required when logging in to the TiVo from any utility, including kmttg, pyTivo (for pushes only), streambaby, HME for Python and any of its tools, another TiVo, or any old web browser. It's also required for TDT.

    Here I am logging in to one of my TiVos using a web browser (FireFox):

    [​IMG]

    The user name is "tivo". The password is my MAK. Every other TiVo application that attempts to contact the TiVo using SHTTP, including TDT, does the exact same thing behind the scenes. The MAK is also used as an encryption / decryption key for decrypting .TiVo files. Again, this is true no matter what utility is doing the decryption.

    Note if you download any shows off the new TiVo when it has its old MAK, then those files can only be decrypted using the old MAK.
     
  2. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,387
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    When you buy a TiVo for which someone else has already purchased Product Lifetime Service, you need to contact TiVo to have it transferred to your account (where your current TiVo already is).

    It wouldn't hurt for the seller to contact them and inform them that they've sold it, but since you already have a TiVo account you have a certain amount of credibility with them and they may just take your word for it, especially if the new one seems to be contacting them from the same location as your old one.

    Your account already has a MAK assigned, and any and all TiVos on that account will be informed of that number.

    If and when you install the TiVo Desktop program on a computer, you'll need to enter the MAK, which you can get from the system info page in the menus or from going online to TiVo and logging onto your account.

    I suggest that you set aside a fair amount of hard drive space on the computer in the form of a separate partition, formatted NTFS, for Desktop to actually copy shows to. It can be on a separate hard drive if you wish and can afford one.

    Desktop itself can install to your C: drive, in the "Program Files" folder, whether it's NT or FAT32, but FAT32 has a file size limitation that will turn a 2 hour show at best quality into a movie with the last 5 minutes missing.

    NTFS avoids that.

    Desktop creates a "My TiVo Recordings" folder, but there's a place in its menus where you can tell it to use a different location for that folder. You should also tell it to put its cache folder there.

    If you screw up, you can uninstall and try again before you actually start copying shows. Desktop calls it transferring, but it's really copying, it doesn't erase the original.

    If you're going to copy shows from one TiVo to another, I recommend using Desktop as an intermediary because that preserves more of the meta-data that goes along with the show, like the date when you originally recorded it and the stuff you see when you hit the "Info" button.

    You only get one MAK per account, you will only have one account, and all of the TiVos on that account will be assigned that one MAK, and any and all computers on your home network running TiVo Desktop will need that same MAK entered when you install Desktop on them.

    That one MAK is what tells the TiVos and the computers running Desktop that they're allowed to talk to each other.

    I can hook you up with a clean 540 image, and direct you to clean copies of MFS Live, WinMFS, and Desktop.

    As far as I know no one has gone to the trouble to produce infected verisons.
     
  3. lrhorer

    lrhorer Active Member

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    Aug 31, 2003
    San...
    But not on another computer.

    But only if it is on the same computer running TDT. If one has a NAS or a LAN server, TDT is hosed.

    With the caveat there is a huge time penalty. TiVoToGo and GoBack are quite slow on S3 TiVos, but they are slow as molasses on an S2. MRV is at least a bit faster. GoBack with h.264 coding on an S3 is much, much faster, but both avoid the use of TDT. I really have very little issue with living without the extra metadata.
     
  4. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    I'm not sure we need to start off by throwing the OP in the deep end.

    Baby steps.
     
  5. MojoB

    MojoB New Member

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    Jun 1, 2012
    What is a 540 image? Right now I'm not going to do any upgrade. I have to work on some other stuff first. But maybe if I reach that point I would ask about how to do that and where to get MFS Live. When you say Desktop I take it you mean Tivo Desktop? I have that running now. What I'd like to do first is be able to transfer my Tivo recordings to a format I can stream on my PS3 and burn to DVD on my PC.
     
  6. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,387
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    You have a TCD540040, which is the model casually referred to as the 540, which can actually mean the one with the 40GB, 80GB, or 120GB hard drive.

    You can, before your 40GB drive goes bad, use MFS Live, or WinMFS, to make a truncated backup of the drive, which won't have any of the shows but will have the operating system and TiVo software, and whatever settings you've established, like zip code, area code, cable company, whether it's set up for satellite or not, and I think season passes, thumb ratings, favorites, and stuff like that, and it'll have a record of the TiVo Service Number of your unit.

    If you use someone else's image, because you didn't make your own and your hard drive went bad and now it's too late, you'll have to go through Guided Setup all over again.

    Also, whatever size stock TiVo drive the image was made from is the smallest size drive onto which you can restore that image.

    For example, if you image your 40GB* drive, you can restore onto a 60GB, but if you get an image made from someone's TCD540080, no go.

    If I capitalize Desktop, at least around here, then I'm almost certainly talking about the free version of the TiVo Desktop program.

    You should go to mfslive.org, read everything about MFS Live and about WinMFS, at least the white background instructional pages, and also go to the download link, which'll take you over to the forum pages, where you can find the link for the bootable cd image for MFS Live v1.4

    Even if you don't own a TiVo you should download that and burn, as an image, yourself a copy onto cd-r.

    It's got stuff that lets you play with hard drives.

    You should also get WinMFS

    Both WinMFS and MFS Live can make and restore TiVo backups, but not each others, so use both and make 2 different backups so that you can restore with either program.

    Once you use TiVo Desktop to copy your recordings to the computer, you can, I am told by others here and have no reason to doubt, convert them into "un-tivo'ed" files.

    I don't think I can give you beter answers than you've received here:

    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=490550

    I will say this about Desktop.

    You should have a (large) partition that's formatted NTFS and not FAT32 to put the My TiVo Recordings folder in/on, because FAT32's file size limitation turns a 2 hour movie into a movie missing the last 5 minutes.

    When you install Desktop it automatically wants to put everything on the C: drive just like everything else that has anything to do with Windows does, but in the options you can change where it keeps that folder.

    Also, once shows have been copied by Desktop to the MTR folder, you can move them to other, perhaps larger, locations, and put a shortcut to those locations inside the MTR folder.

    At least as long as that other location is on a local hard drive (one actually hooked directly to the computer running TDT).


    Perhaps you should PM or email me a list of your TiVo and computer hardware and an idea of what kind of budget, if any, you have to make changes and improvements, and I can better advise you.


    *some of the Series 2 TiVos used Maxtor brand hard drives that had a slightly larger LBA number for the same nominal size than other brands, so, for example, my TCD540040 image won't restore onto a 40GB Western Digital or Seagate, because it expects a little more room.
     
  7. MojoB

    MojoB New Member

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    Jun 1, 2012
    If and when I upgrade my Tivo hard drive, I wouldn't mind going through guided setup but I would worry if I didn't have the Tivo Service Number and I needed to have it for some reason. I'm assuming the OS and Tivo Software would install the latest version after setup.

    I cannot do this right now because I have to fix my computer first and have other crap to work on unfortunately. Thank you for your help.
     
  8. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    The TiVo already knows what its TiVo Service Number is.

    At least the motherboard does, and the hard drive will learn it from the motherboard.

    TiVos, at least S2s, have both a unique serial number and a TiVo Service Number.

    The TiVo Service Number (which is printed on the sticker on the back of the TiVo where the AC line cord plugs in) is unique to each TiVo, and, up through the original Series 3, was on a separate crypto chip which, with some difficulty, could be moved from one motherboard to another of the same overall model, and since the servers at TiVo keep track of what kind of, if any, subscription a particular TiVo has by that number, you can move a lifetime sub from one motherboard to another of the same model.

    Or you can move the TSN of a non-lifetimed board so as to still be able to access 2TB worth of recordings, like I had to.

    For instance, your 540 would have the same motherboard regardless of whether it originally came with a 40GB, 80GB, or 120GB hard drive, so any of those would be crypto chip transplant candidates.


    The MAK is a unique number assigned to your overall TiVo account, is not located on the motherboard, and is shared by all the TiVos on that account and any computers running TiVo Desktop on your home network.
     
  9. mattack

    mattack Active Member

    20,734
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    Apr 9, 2001
    sunnyvale
    By "original Series 3", do you mean the OLED?

    If so, is that implying that it is NOT possible to do that on the TivoHD nor Premiere models?
     
  10. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    Yepper.

    The TCD648 still had the separate crypto chip.

    Starting with the 652 and 658, the TSN is built into a bigger chip along with a bunch of other stuff, and it's on there in such a way that it's cheaper to buy a new TiVo and lifetime sub than the equipment needed to do the removals and replacements.

    I think the "prom day" guy over on the "other site" discusses it some.
     
  11. alansh

    alansh New Member

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    Jan 3, 2003
    Phoenix, AZ
    Just to touch on the original question: to get the longest life out of a hard drive, don't turn it off. Power cycles are hard on it. Other than that, leave it alone. I don't know of any specs that give a reduced life for a hard drive that just does a lot of read/writes.

    As for doing a restart before pulling the plug, it certainly doesn't hurt, but I don't believe it accomplishes anything either. Doing a restart doesn't close programs or files first -- it just does a hard reset. The filesystem for programs is designed to not need cleaning up, and the only Linux filesystem that is writable will be rebuilt if it's corrupt.

    And motherboard failures are quite rare. The only significant numbers were of modem failures on the original Series 1. Power supply or hard drive is all that's likely to fail, and both can be repaired without affecting your subscription.
     
  12. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    Motherboard failures are very rare on the TiVo, especially compared to power supply and hard drive (and if not for "capacitor plague", power supply failures would be a lot less frequent), but since the failure of the internal modem on the S1s could be dealt with (at least one guy offered parts, and there was always the external modem option), it's not quite the same as an out and out "doesn't work anymore" motherboard.
     
  13. replaytv

    replaytv gun talk ignore list

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    Denver ish...
    Does the time shift recording that goes on actually record to the hard drive or does it just keep it in RAM?
    I have a hard time believing that a Tivo that runs for over 10 years recording time shift recording to hard drive would last that long. It is one thing for a hard drive to be spinning all the time, but a whole other thing to be recording 365 days a year 24 hours the time lapse for 30 minutes that takes place all the time.

    You can stop the 30 minute time lapse 'recording' by going into some of the setting menus, but I don't know how long it will stay in that none recording mode.
    Other brands of DVRs actually spin down the the hard drive when you turn them 'off'.
     
  14. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

    19,173
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    Jan 31, 2002
    Northern...
    It records it to the hard drive. Hard drives have no problem reading and writing for ten years. It is nothing unusual. Hard drives can last a lot longer than that. Of course other factors can cause a hard drive to die a lot sooner.

    My six DirecTV TiVos that I gave to some friend's are still running with no issues with upgraded hard drives. And they are around eight and ten years old since the drives were upgraded.

    Sent from my HTC ReZound using Forum Runner
     
  15. unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    The original S1s didn't have enough RAM to do that.

    The new ones probably don't either.
     
  16. shwru980r

    shwru980r Active Member

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    Jun 22, 2008
    You can easily find a TCD540040 for sale on craig's list as low as $10 - $20. Just buy one and keep it in the attic for spare parts. The parts cost next to nothing. It's easier just to replace them when they go bad.

    It doesn't happen often, but every once in a while I will turn on the TV and find see a program on that I didn't record, but would like to watch. Since Tivo was recording on the buffer, I can go back to the beginning and watch it.
     
  17. lrhorer

    lrhorer Active Member

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    Aug 31, 2003
    San...
    At roughly 200M per minute (for two tuners), or 300G per half hour? In a machine with 128M of RAM? Hardly.

    Why would you find that hard to believe? I doubt the average TiVo will last quite that long, or at least not much longer than that, but certainly many TiVos will. My S1 lasted 12 years.

    Again, why would you think that? The spindle bearings are under a much greater load than the recording head mechanism, and are much more susceptible to heat stress. That said, it is true the drive will be somewhat hotter when continuously seeking all over the platters than when idle or seeking sequentially, but the additional heat load is not huge nor hugely significant to the first order.

    Name one, please. Then please provide evidence that brand lasts longer than a TiVo.
     
  18. lrhorer

    lrhorer Active Member

    6,924
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    Aug 31, 2003
    San...
    'Not even close. In fact, further away. The newer TiVos only have a bit more RAM, and are recording at a much greater rate than the S1.
     
  19. MojoB

    MojoB New Member

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    Jun 1, 2012
    I have a tendency to zone out a lot or stop to do something else when watching recordings. When you press rewind/pause/fast forward continuously is it only accessing different data from the RAM or is the hard drive spinning to different areas? I tend to often rewind anywhere from a couple seconds to 5 minutes.

    I don't understand why Tivo's don't have a power button so you can let the thing rest at least every now and then given all this real time recording. Even standby doesn't stop it, what is the point of standby?
     
  20. steve614

    steve614 what ru lookin at?

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    May 1, 2006
    Dallas, TX
    It keeps emergency alerts from ruining your recordings... :p
     

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