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Hooking up Stream without hardwired TiVo

Discussion in 'TiVo Stream' started by ort, Sep 6, 2012.

  1. BigJimOutlaw

    BigJimOutlaw Active Member

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    Mar 21, 2004
    The Tivo site sells moca adapters for $50. Still not cheap but it's cheaper than most other locations.
     
  2. wkearney99

    wkearney99 Bill Kearney

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    Dec 5, 2003
    Bethesda,...
    First, inside a duct is called 'plenum' rated, a flume is something you'd ride at the amusement part.

    Second, it's a common argument tactic to just label things expensive as a quick way to dismiss the idea. I purposefully didn't mention the high cost of MOCA adapters. Not just because they're expensive but because they're a LOT more expensive than wire. And still bring along the long-term hassle. More money and on-going adventures vs simple wire.

    I wouldn't think that logic is hard to understand. Combine their expense with network performance and compatibility issues and it really makes these look like they're more trouble than they're worth. Compared to just simple wire, that is.

    There's another thing to consider, what else might be at that location that could use network connectivity. Like another streaming device (apple tv, roku, etc), an additional wireless access point or perhaps a home theater PC.

    Just think seriously and honestly about what will work reliably long term before spending the money either way.
     
  3. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Nevada
    1000' of plenum rated cat5e is $175 from Monoprice. A MoCa adapter is $50 from TiVo. (See here) Outdoor cat5e is a little cheaper at $122 for 1000' but it's still cheaper, and easier, to buy two Moca adapters.

    As for speed... You're right there are compromises with speed. But when it comes to TiVo it doesn't really matter. TiVo's are limited by other factors. When you transfer something between two TiVos, or TiVo to PC, there is an encryption process involved that is CPU bound and will never saturate even a MoCa network. For the Stream they're using MRS which is a little different, but the stream itself can still only recode at about 1/3-1/2 realtime. For a full HD stream that's still only about 40Mbps. If you're transferring large files between two PCs then MoCa may not be sufficient, but for TiVo use it's fine.

    Dan
     
  4. supasta

    supasta New Member

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    May 6, 2006
    Colorado
    I am using an Apple Airport Extreme based wireless network. The TiVo Stream is connected via ethernet to the Extreme.
    I then have a AirPort Express set as a wireless bridge hardwired to a 5-port Netgear switch. This is all housed in the media center in an adjacent room and connects to all of my devices with ethernet.

    The TiVo Stream works flawlessly. No stuttering and excellent response. Transfer times are comparable to times suggested by TiVo.
    This may be another option, although cost may still be a sticking point ($99). I was also in a position that running wiring was not an option.

    Of note, the same setup did work well with both the TiVo and the Stream connected to the switch and then to the Express, but space was at a premium in the cabinet, so I moved the Stream.
     
  5. PROxac

    PROxac PressureDrop

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    Dec 24, 2005
    ATL
    what kind of house do you live in that would need 1000' between the router and your TiVo?? I live in a large 2 story house and I ran cat6 to each room from our "office" where I have my main switch and modem/router located, and I was no where close to 1000'. Also you can buy pre-made cables in 3', 6', 10', 25', 50', 100', and even 150+ lengths - fine for most people. You can simply run them along with the coax (like what was already said) with not much effort. You then have the expansion on your network to run anything you will ever need, have no potential software/hardware issues, no power on/off issues, and it is a guaranteed connection between the 2 ends of the cat6.
    And there is no other (MoCa / power line) hardware required :) :up:
    I am gigabit to every room in my house, we have 3 TiVos with Blu-Ray, Xbox, Wii, etc at each TV - MoCa / power line adapters would "work" and be slow and aggravating, what I have is always on and never the issue when something is not working.

    Now all that said,
    I am looking to put a stream in at my mother-in-laws which is on the other side of the country. I am not sure what the attic / crawl space / roof options are for running a wire at her location, and I will not be there to do it, so we are looking at either MoCa or power line. I have used mega Plug AV (200mbps) in the past but it was not for the stream. I see mixed reviews about it working for the stream so ...
    ... I am looking at these 2 possibilities to send to my mother-in-law:
    ZyXEL Powerline AV 500 Mbps 4 Port Gigabit Switch (would give the option of more ports down the road)
    or
    Actiontec Ethernet to Coax Adapter Kit



    Has anyone tested the 500 mbps power line options with the stream?
    It is rated for more speed than the MoCa - is it real?
    MoCa is supported and tested even though it only offers 175mbps.
    Feedback please? :)
     
  6. PROxac

    PROxac PressureDrop

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    ATL
    Anyone? :confused:
     
  7. jrtroo

    jrtroo User

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    The stream is not a radio- it can be anywhere hardwired in the network. Put it in a closet next to the router.
     
  8. PROxac

    PROxac PressureDrop

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    ATL
    ?

    Her current Tivo is using WiFi, I need to get either of the options in my post to use in place of WiFi so she can use the stream. The stream will go right with the router in another room, I got that covered heh.
     
  9. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Nevada
    If the wifi is N and has a good connection then it mig work OK. This is all just networking. The TiVo is streaming a program to the Stream box just like it would if you had two TiVos and where trying to watch the program in another room. The Stream then recodes to H.264 and sends that over to your iPad.

    So if there is a dedicated wifi N bridge between the TiVo and the leg of the network the Stream is connected to it'll likely work just fine. If the iPad and the TiVo share the same wifi network then it might still work, but you'll be pushing it.

    I had an AV200 powerline networking bridge when I first bought my Stream. It worked fine. Downloads were slow, but streaming worked fine. At least for one iPad anyway.

    I switched to the Actiontech MoCa adapter and streaming still works fine and downloads are now twice as fast.

    Dan
     
  10. PROxac

    PROxac PressureDrop

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    currently 802.11g so its going to get replaced with one of the 2 options I have in my earlier post:
    the AV 500 specs show it faster than the Actiontec, but TiVo likes the Actiontec so I suppose that is what I should use in spite of speed.
     
  11. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Apr 17, 2000
    Nevada
    I've never used the AV500, but from what I understand it's highly dependent on the quality of the electrical wiring and the noise introduced by the electrical devices connected to the house. The coax lines tend to only have a couple things connected so interference is a lot less likely so in most cases MoCa works better even though it has a lower theoretical speed.

    Remember to get a POE filter if you're going to get MoCa. Most cable companies require them to prevent interference with neighbors signals, and they will actually boost the MoCa signal a little by reflecting it back into the line. Plus they're only a few dollars.

    Dan
     
  12. PROxac

    PROxac PressureDrop

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    Ordered. thanks!
     
  13. spock

    spock New Member

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    Franklin, TN
    Do you know what generation your Airport Extreme is? I have a 1st generation and wondered if the antenna enhancements were a factor in your setup.
     
  14. TivoInNY

    TivoInNY Tivo Addict

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    Dec 19, 2002
    New York
    Just thought I'd add my experiences with a new Tivo Stream.

    My setup:
    - Hardwired Ethernet Tivo Premiere Elite (XL4)
    - Hardwired Ethernet S3
    - Tivo Premiere XL ethernet to 802.11n bridge (old Asus router in bridge mode thanks to DD-WRT)
    - Apple Time Machine (latest generation) as my wireless router (802.11n), which is equivalent to an Airport Extreme.
    - Tivo Stream connected to a Trendnet 8-port Gb switch that's connected to the Time Machine.

    I figured that I'd either have to run wire to the Premiere XL or get a MoCA adapter (and enable the bridge on the Elite), but so far, it doesn't look like I'm going to need to.

    Setup of the Stream went smoothly and I'm able to watch programming on an iPad 4th gen from any of the three Tivos, including the one connected via wireless bridge. No stuttering, high-quality video. I haven't done much benchmarking on transfers, so I'm not sure how much faster downloads run from the hardwired Tivos, but it works for all three, in any case.

    So, in summary, it looks like a quality 802.11n router along with a good 802.11n bridge for the Tivo (which I think is what the Tivo-branded "n" adapter actually is) might be a workable Stream solution, as long as a strong signal is available for the bridge. I get why Tivo doesn't technically support it, but wanted to provide another data point showing it can work.
     
  15. bananagrabbers

    bananagrabbers New Member

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    May 26, 2011
    I have always had my TiVo connected to the web via an Airport Express. I simply tell it to serve ethernet service, rather than extending the network, and the TiVo treats it like a router connection. I am sure this set-up is well-known, as I think I learned about it here!

    Obviously, the problem I encountered with the Stream was not being able to hook it up to the Express, which only has one ethernet jack. So I took a shot at simply plugging it into my router (located on the other side of the house, almost as far as it could possibly be from my TiVo) and hoping for the best.

    It worked! I am pretty happy, as I wanted to use the Stream, but didn't think it was worth fundamentally altering my network and home entertainment set-up.
     
  16. jrtroo

    jrtroo User

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    Feb 4, 2008
    The stream does not have a radio, so its location is irrelevant.
     
  17. ort

    ort Member

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    Jan 5, 2004
    I finally got a Stream and got this set up.

    I have my router and stream down in my basement and my TiVo Premiere upstairs connected via the Wireless N Dongle.

    It works pretty well most of the time, but there are some rooms where it has trouble getting and maintaining a connection.

    I think I either need to move everything upstairs, or setup a wifi repeater.

    Either way, it can wait.

    I was annoyed though, because for the first hour or so, it wouldn't work at all. Nothing would stream. Then something just happened and everything worked great. I have not idea what changed.
     
  18. compnurd

    compnurd New Member

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    Oct 6, 2011
    Probably the software update. Mine took a little bit to get going also
     

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