1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Homeland S02E12 "The Choice" 12/16/2012

Discussion in 'Now Playing - TV Show Talk' started by robojerk, Dec 17, 2012.

  1. tiams

    tiams New Member

    2,363
    0
    Apr 19, 2004
    Well there's your problem, it is NOT the goal of the show to make her a patriotic law enforcement agent.
     
  2. Bob Coxner

    Bob Coxner Active Member

    2,045
    0
    Dec 1, 2004
    Setting aside all the plot holes, I still have a huge problem with the Carrie-Brody romance. Sexual heat, ok, I can buy that. Making eyes and playing house at the cabin by the lake, no, that was embarrassing. Carrie risking her dream career for a married terrorist with children?

    I was a huge Carrie fan in season 1. Season 2 turned her into a ridiculous figure and very unlikeable.

    For those enjoying Mandy Patinkin's performance, check out Dead Like Me. His character there had much the same attitude and it was a great show.
     
  3. jehma

    jehma Active Member

    5,166
    0
    Jan 22, 2003
    NJ

    I loved him in Dead Like Me :up:
     
  4. astrohip

    astrohip Well-Known Member TCF Club

    10,058
    40
    Jan 6, 2003
    Houston &...
  5. ireland967

    ireland967 Member

    3,346
    4
    Feb 27, 2003
    Chicago
    I agree with everything here. With the awards the show, Lewis and Danes received I suppose Showtime was keen on keeping them around as long as possible. The plot holes bother me, but not enough to keep from watching the show
     
  6. gchance

    gchance 4 8 15 16 23 42

    12,632
    0
    Dec 6, 2002
    Olivehurst, CA
    In Sepinwall's article, he mentions the showrunners would be having a post-mortem conference call this morning, and he'd be posting about it later. I'm thinking that's what Maureen Ryan's interview is from. Maybe. ;)

    Greg
     
  7. astrohip

    astrohip Well-Known Member TCF Club

    10,058
    40
    Jan 6, 2003
    Houston &...
    Alan Sepinwall's take on the same interview...

    http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-wa...future-sauls-loyalties-and-more-from-season-2



    One excerpt, addressing the "keep the stars around" controversy...

     
  8. MikeAndrews

    MikeAndrews Registered abuser

    14,222
    1
    Jan 17, 2002
    Northern...
    YeahIKnow. How much baby bump you gonna see from her back? I'm guessing she couldn't stand very long.

    Then again, if you watched the last ep closely you can see where they cut to the double in full length long shots, mostly when she's walking away.

    They also have her in really loose navy blue blouses and pants.
     
  9. Gerryex

    Gerryex Member

    890
    0
    Apr 24, 2004
    Land O...
    :up:

    I agree 100%. Yes, this season was not as great as last season and its getting a little more like "24" in some of its unbelieveable plot holes. BUT its still orders of magnitude better than most of the other shows out there and I DO look forward to the next season!!

    Gerry
     
  10. MikeAndrews

    MikeAndrews Registered abuser

    14,222
    1
    Jan 17, 2002
    Northern...
    Sure. Carrie will prove to Saul that Brody didn't have anything to do with the car bomb, ....ummm becuase she was with him looking to get some nookie in Saul's office so they can clear his name...except for that A MEMBER OF CONGRESS attempted a plot to blow up the Vice-President of the United States and SecDef with a suicide vest - complete with video confession, murdered Tom Walker on Nazir's order, caused the death of the tailor bomb maker while attempting to save him, and paid a key role in the murder of the Vice-President, Brody is CLEAN!

    Oh. There's that minor matter of the coverup of the hit-and-run death that will make for a nice weekend news story.

    Then Carrie and Nick live happily ever after. :rolleyes:

    Brody can write a memoir and get rich!
     
  11. TAsunder

    TAsunder Debates Ghee vs Gi

    17,057
    47
    Aug 6, 2003
    Madison, WI
    Not really. Season 1 had a lot of plot problems and holes towards the end. It had just earned a bit of slack by then. This season certainly had more plot issues, but it's not like everything in season 1 was credible.
     
  12. Hank

    Hank AC•FTW

    20,887
    10
    May 31, 2000
    Boston, MA
    But it was credible "enough". That's my point.
     
  13. DreadPirateRob

    DreadPirateRob Seriously?

    18,251
    31
    Nov 11, 2002
    SoCal
    Those are only plot holes if you're bound and determined to find them.

    1) Quinn didn't "fall in love" with Carrie and Brody. He just realized there was no reason to kill them. (Of course, as it turns out, he was wrong). He's allowed to have his own moral code, especially when the entire op was off the books and Estes has no control over him. (See below.)

    2) Estes is a suit - and a former analyst. Quinn is a wet ops killer. He knows that Quinn could kill him without batting an eye and no one would ever know, and he also knows that he has no direct control over him (the CIA has two separate branches: Intelligence and Ops, and Estes is Deputy Director on the Intelligence side, but has no direct control over the Ops side. Quinn reports to Dar Adal, not Estes).

    3) I'm assuming that whoever planted the C4 did it after Brody passed through security. Presumably the same person also moved Brody's Tahoe so that it would maximize the carnage.

    4) This was a private CIA ceremony because Walden was formerly the head of the CIA. Presumably the President was present at whatever formal funeral there was. Saul was not high enough in the CIA to where he would have had to be there. (Since Estes was DDI, at most Saul was the head of a sub-group), and he probably didn't want to be there.

    5) Not really - wasn't the plan to walk over the border at an unmanned area, and then get on a private boat? I can't remember the details. But they certainly didn't rely exclusively on fake IDs.
     
  14. DreadPirateRob

    DreadPirateRob Seriously?

    18,251
    31
    Nov 11, 2002
    SoCal
    Still not plot holes.

    1) This was inside a presumably secure perimeter, so security would probably be a little lax. That's what Nazir was counting on - that people's guard would be let down. There has to be a mole who placed the C4 in Brody's Tahoe and then moved it next to the building.

    2) It seemed like Carrie came back the day after the bombin, no? The bombing took place during the daytime. Carrie said goodbye to Brody the border drop-off at night, and then it was daylight when she showed herself to Saul.

    3) Seriously? You think that's a plot hole?
     
  15. robojerk

    robojerk Active Member

    2,325
    7
    Jun 13, 2006
    Laguna Hills CA
    Nope. If you're job is to be an assassin for the CIA, how in what way is it acceptable to not do the job. Him not doing the task he was given to do is foolish.

    Also the same CIA, in both fiction and non-fiction worlds, collect info and organize drone strikes. Innocents get caught up all the time in drone strikes but it's deemed acceptable. Brody is also anything but an innocent. He wore a suicide bomb, he helped kill the VP (even though no one never looked into how/why the VP died suddenly. Really?!). Even if we just ignored the fact Estes and the VP were dirty and killing Brody would cover up their sins, Brody deserved to die.

    The writers intentionally wrote the fact that no one investigated the sudden heart attack of the VP, that Quinn is now a black ops guy with a conscience (which will probably eat at him next season if he's still on the show), and true love conquers all, even though the people in love are bat **** crazy.
     
  16. TAsunder

    TAsunder Debates Ghee vs Gi

    17,057
    47
    Aug 6, 2003
    Madison, WI
    We don't know that it was even the next day that carrie was back. I thought they made some throw away remark that it would take days to clear out the bodies, and then we saw all of them in a body bag. I had assumed it had been a couple of days.
     
  17. markp99

    markp99 TakoKichi TCF Club

    11,130
    16
    Mar 21, 2002
    Nashua, NH
    Yep, Heard that line; this was my thought too. They needed to account for the drive time.
     
  18. DreadPirateRob

    DreadPirateRob Seriously?

    18,251
    31
    Nov 11, 2002
    SoCal
    The point was that Estes had no operational control over Quinn, and the whole thing was entirely off the books. Quinn was and is Dar Adul's guy. Presumably Estes asked Dar Adul for a favor, and Dar Adul lent him Quinn. Who knows - maybe Quinn talked to Dar Adul and Dar Adul told him that killing Brody was no longer an imperative. We didn't see that happen, but that doesn't mean that it didn't happen. But you seem to assume that just because Estes still wanted him to take out Brody that Quinn was obligated to do so. That is not the case.
     
  19. john4200

    john4200 Active Member

    4,524
    3
    Oct 31, 2009
    How? It was an unlawful order. He had a duty not to obey it.
     
  20. TAsunder

    TAsunder Debates Ghee vs Gi

    17,057
    47
    Aug 6, 2003
    Madison, WI
    Also, does the CIA even have jurisdiction to do that in the US?
     

Share This Page