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** HD TiVo and HD DirecTV TiVo FAQ **

Discussion in 'DirecTV TiVo Powered PVRs & Receivers' started by feldon23, Jan 1, 2004.

  1. Jan 14, 2004 #161 of 1440
    GalenMD

    GalenMD New Member

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    Does this mean that the interface is an additional accessory or included?

    TiVo has often been good about including a variety of cables. I have seen them include S-video cables and digital cable STB conversion cables.

    I was planning on buying such a cable now in anticipation of this bad-boy's arrival.
     
  2. Jan 15, 2004 #162 of 1440
    DTV TiVo Dealer

    DTV TiVo Dealer Snr. Member/Retailer

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    Cables included are one each of the following (in order of performance quality):

    1. Coax w/Type "F" male connectors
    2. RCA, Yellow/Red/White
    3. "S" Video
    4. Component video Pb, Pr, Y, Red/Green/Blue
    5. HDMI to DVI
    6. HDMI to HDMI

    Plus 1 optical AC3 cable.
     
  3. Jan 15, 2004 #163 of 1440
    Alexander

    Alexander New Member

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    Just to clarify, an HDMI->HDMI connection will have the exact same picture quality as a HDMI->DVI connection.
     
  4. Jan 15, 2004 #164 of 1440
    DTV TiVo Dealer

    DTV TiVo Dealer Snr. Member/Retailer

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    Well I think some more highly qualified members may correct me here, but here's what I've been told. HDMI carries several protocols that analyze the handshake to determine the best resolution to pass to the display based on the native resolution and the display capabilities.

    Of course, HDMI can also carry the DD audio signals.
     
  5. Jan 15, 2004 #165 of 1440
    feldon23

    feldon23 MythBuster

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    I've updated the FAQ again. Cleaned up the connections/formats info.
     
  6. Jan 15, 2004 #166 of 1440
    jkrell

    jkrell New Member

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    Great job, man. I really appreciated the new/updated info!
     
  7. Jan 15, 2004 #167 of 1440
    MrBigglesworth

    MrBigglesworth Tivo Addict

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    Noticed one error, you have the word easy where it should be east.

    Also, does anyone know that since this unit is using a single 250GB Drive, would it then be capable of supporting an additional 250GB drive using the same upgrade methods we use now?
     
  8. Jan 15, 2004 #168 of 1440
    dswallow

    dswallow Save the Moderatоr TCF Club

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    feldon23 apparently has a subliminal fascination for "easy" things as noted earlier in this thread. :D
     
  9. Jan 15, 2004 #169 of 1440
    feldon23

    feldon23 MythBuster

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    Guess I never fixed it the first time.

    For upgrades, we're not even sure if it has the ability. I know that 2 drives on a single IDE cable is not gonna work for HDTV. So if they only put one IDE or ATA connector, we're screwed.
     
  10. Jan 15, 2004 #170 of 1440
    BrettStah

    BrettStah Well-Known Member TCF Club

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    So you think/know that there is not enough bandwidth on one IDE controller?
     
  11. Jan 15, 2004 #171 of 1440
    feldon23

    feldon23 MythBuster

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    Based on seeing 2 hard drives fight for bandwidth on every computer I've ever used with 2 drives on an ATA/xxx cable/bus.

    If you look in the user manual for Plextor CD burners, it tells you this drive will not work properly past 8x if its on a shared cable.

    I've got my hard drives each on their own ATA/133 cable, and my CD-RW and DVD-ROM each on their own cable.
     
  12. Jan 15, 2004 #172 of 1440
    MrBigglesworth

    MrBigglesworth Tivo Addict

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    On my computer on the second channel I have a standard DVD Rom and on the slave of that I have a 40X LiteOn burner, never had a problem burning @ 40X either, but that may be due to the DVD Rom not being used at the time.
     
  13. Jan 15, 2004 #173 of 1440
    jautor

    jautor Also wants a pony

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    I seriously doubt the IDE bus would be an issue here. Even *IF* the HD-DirecTiVo was using the ancient UltraATA/33 specification, they should have sufficient bandwidth. I think it's likely that the box uses either UltraATA/66 or UltraATA/100. The HD-TiVo's worst case (I'm rounding) is 19.2Mb/s times 3 (2 record, 1 playback), plus some overhead. Still, that's only 7.2MB/s, compared to the burst rates available on the bus of 66MB/s or more. Bits vs. Bytes - big difference...

    Now, if the unit can get all of this data on and off a single drive, a two-drive system should be easier to keep up with. Since we're not adding bandwidth (you can still only do 3 HD streams max.), best case, you'll still be able to stream off of one of the drives while the other one is seeking to get the next track...

    Yes, yes, nothing is that simple, but remember also that TiVo's data access is probably very sequential (big files), so most of the time, the drive(s) is able to burst efficiently. And yes, they most certainly are using the DMA modes, since their architecture allows them to send data between the receiver (or encoder in the standalone TiVos) and the disk, or from disk to decoder, without that data travelling through the main CPU/memory.

    Feldon is right, though, we're not even sure it has the ability. But it's not the IDE bus to blame. Heck, it's probably not even an electrical issue. If anything, it'll be a software, thermal, or mechanical issue that prevents it...

    Jeff
     
  14. Jan 15, 2004 #174 of 1440
    dswallow

    dswallow Save the Moderatоr TCF Club

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    That's because when you're sharing a hard drive with a CD/DVD recorder, every increase in speed you get from a faster recorder also requires faster hard drive access. So (just making up numbers) if your recorder at 1x needs 1MB/second, then you're using 1MB/second for the recorder and 1MB/second for the hard drive to read the data to be recorded, or a total of 2MB/second. Then at 8x the recorder would need 8MB/second to handle the data it's writing, and it'd have to be reading it from the hard drive at 8MB/second too, for a total of 16MB/second over the IDE channel.

    The DirecTV HD DVR is going to need XXmb/second of bandwidth to do it's writing and reading from the single hard drive. Adding another hard drive isn't going to require it read or write faster or more data, just from/to different locations.

    There's no practical reason it couldn't perform properly with 2 hard drives on a shared IDE cable.
     
  15. Jan 15, 2004 #175 of 1440
    hongcho

    hongcho .

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    2 HD recording + 1 HD reading... That's 3 x 19 Mbps, which is around 60 Mbps. Well, there will be seeks and other data access and stuff, so it may need to be a bit higher. But that seems within even the 5400 rpm disks.

    Hong.
     
  16. Jan 15, 2004 #176 of 1440
    rogo

    rogo Member

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    Right, 60 megabits / per second.... <8 megabytes / second.... Chump change for the bus.
     
  17. Jan 17, 2004 #177 of 1440
    Gromit

    Gromit Active Member

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    I hope I didn't overlook the answers in the FAQ or the rest of the thread, but I'm curious about the following:

    I have a single LNB dish, a 2 x 4 switch and 2 DirecTiVo receivers.

    DirecTV appears to offer a "SAT-C" upgrade kit for free, but doesn't that require an oval dual-LNB dish to begin with? I'm guessing that I'm going to need to replace my round dish. What's the best option for doing that?

    What switch will I need? Will the antenna for local channels run to my switch or directly to the HD-DirecTiVo? Would the switch be a 3 x 4? Could I use my current DirecTiVo box along with the new HD box? I'm guessing that would require a 3 x 6 switch and a lot of holes in the side of my house to allow those cables to get to the receivers.

    antennaweb.org shows that I need a multi-directional, powered antenna (25 miles away). The map does show that signals would come from various directions, but the only channels I'm interested in all come from the same general compass area. Is it safe to assume that I could get away with a smaller, directional antenna or is that just a trial and error thing?

    Thanks!
     
  18. Jan 17, 2004 #178 of 1440
    dswallow

    dswallow Save the Moderatоr TCF Club

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    You need the 3-LNB elliptical dish or the newer Phase III 3-LNB dish; DirecTV will provide that to you free or at low cost when you add HD to your configuration... just call and talk to them about it. They'll also deal with your multiswitch, including if you need more than 4 outputs. The multiswitch will be 4x4 or 4x8 or 5x4 or 5x8 (5 inputs including the 4 LNB signals and an over the air antenna). So if you've got a place inside for the multiswitch, you'll have 4 coax cables from the dish plus a coax cable from your antenna involved in coming into the house.

    Receiving over-the-air really is an art more than a science and can be affected by surrounding terrain and buildings and trees, but if everything's within 25 miles, you should have a really good chance of getting that cluster of stations within the same general direction of just about any decent antenna. If all you need is UHF for the digital channels in your area, look at the Channel Master 4228 antenna... and possibly a preamp like the Channel Master 7777 or 7775; if you also need VHF, that's still a good antenna and you could add a compact VHF-only antenna to it. Nothing's really safe to assume; expect some trial and error involved in getting things positioned and aimed correctly. Having a rotator wouldn't be a bad idea since it'd let you experiment from the comfort of your living room.
     
  19. Jan 17, 2004 #179 of 1440
    Gromit

    Gromit Active Member

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    Thanks! I just checked and the stations I need are UHF only (no VHF). I guess that makes it a bit easier. I'll check out the Channel Master 4228. Ooops, NBC is VHF.

    Is there a problem with having my switch outside? That just makes it easier to run the lines upstairs (2 story family room makes things difficult). I'm guessing it doesn't matter either way. It sounds like the OTA antenna signal can go to the switch or the receiver. I'll have to figure out which will be easier.

    I think I'm going to be OK with the OTA signal strength, I just hope I can get away with putting the antenna in the attic vs on the roof.
     
  20. Jan 17, 2004 #180 of 1440
    dswallow

    dswallow Save the Moderatоr TCF Club

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    If you get an outdoor-rated powered multiswitch like the Terk BMS-58 5x8 unit, ~$100, no problem putting it outside, the antenna feeds into it, and every signal is amplified so you don't lose strength because of all the splitting, and it receives power over a separate coax cable from a transformer inside someplace. There are some powered multiswitches that are indoor-only so would need to be in a weatherproof enclosure if mounted outside. That gives you a little more flexibility to have the OTA antenna signals everywhere there's satellite signals, but if you need OTA only in one place, a direct wire run from the antenna is good, too.

    As long as you've got only a single layer of standard shingles and obstructions in the signal path in your attic (like a firnace/air handler unit), an attic install will probably present no problems to receiving the stations you want. And the CM4228 is compact enough to fit in most attics, though you might need to pay attention to your attic access if the opening is small. :)
     

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