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Good Bye TiVo

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by Joey Bagadonuts, May 25, 2013.

  1. May 29, 2013 #61 of 189
    Richard Cranium

    Richard Cranium New Member

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    Sup, Mark!!!

    I never had TW, I was a long time DTV/TiVo sub, loved it, but went HD with Cablevision/Premire and finally FIOS/Premiere.

    Nothing but problems... Wife finally called DTV herself and had us "reinstated" and had them send a couple of HR24's she managed to negotiate for free. We just want something that recorded a show when we asked it to without all the lookups, reboots, etc.

    I just made a killer deal for 2 Genies by "committing" for 2 years and couldn't be happier.

    I don't remember "Little DB" but I went through so many of them...

    Personally, "Richard Cranium" was my all time favorite. :)
     
  2. May 29, 2013 #62 of 189
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    So you don't think the $100+ a month he pays them for the privilege of watching their channels is enough?

    TWC has show plenty of disdain for CableCARDs in the past. They were even fined $20,000 by the FCC in 1997 for purposefully trying to hinder access of CableCARDs to their programming. The ONLY reason they even offer tuning adapters is because they are required to by law, and they still make installation and setup as difficult as possible to push people towards their own DVR instead.

    In many other regions, with different MSOs, CableCARDs and tuning adapters work exactly as they are suppose to with few, if any, problems.
     
  3. May 29, 2013 #63 of 189
    Richard Cranium

    Richard Cranium New Member

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    By that reasoning I should call DirecTV and demand a truck roll the next time my Hulu or Roku acts up. I mean , what am I paying $100+ a month for, right? :rolleyes:

    Once again, if you choose to buy a Ferrarri from a KIA dealer, and use it as a daily driver, it's kind of silly to get mad at the dealer for charging you $1400 for a tune up and giving you a KIA for a "courtesy" car.
     
  4. May 29, 2013 #64 of 189
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Not even close to the same thing. TWC is required by law to support 3rd party devices via CableCARDs. These devices are certified by an industry group called CableLabs, which includes members from TWC. If there was a problem with the TiVo hardware it should have been caught during the certification process. Once a device is certified then it should work with ALL MSO's CableCARDs and Tuning Adapters. To further help support this system the FCC also requires that all cable company leased equipment uses CableCARDs too. They're pre-setup and usually locked behind a little door, but all of their own DVRs have the exact same CableCARD you'd install in a TiVo. They do not use Tuning Adapters, as they're allowed to use internal hardware for 2-way communication, but the TA should be using the same basic equipment as their own boxes.

    Not to mention CableCARDs have been available since 2007 and TAs since 2009, so they've had plenty of time to figure this stuff out. If they still can't get it working then it's either intentional or incompetence, either way it's their own damn fault if they have to keep rolling trucks.

    One more point of data proving it's TWC and not TiVo... People in TWC areas with Media Center PCs using CableCARD tuners have just as many problems getting them setup and with intermittent issues with the TA. So like I said TWC is either doing it on purpose to push people to their equipment or they're incompetent, either way it's their fault not TiVo's.
     
  5. May 29, 2013 #65 of 189
    cwerdna

    cwerdna Proud Tivolutionary

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    SF Bay Area, CA
    Yep. I've gone lifetime on all my TiVos (except the DTiVo that used in the past, where I couldn't get lifetime). I passed the breakeven point for lifetime on all of them, some of them ages ago.
     
  6. May 29, 2013 #66 of 189
    Bigg

    Bigg Active Member

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    Verizon Wireless caring about customers? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
     
  7. May 30, 2013 #67 of 189
    button1066

    button1066 New Member

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    Well on the positive side it only took 13 years for you to deal with the problem and take decisive action so as to avoid prolonged annoyance. At this rate you might be poised to dump your cable provider for someone better in is as little time as a decade from now. Maybe get a better trash company in 20 years' time and fix all the other problems with dodgy service providers by the time NASA puts a human on Mars.
     
  8. May 30, 2013 #68 of 189
    BobCamp1

    BobCamp1 Active Member

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    Wow, I laughed so hard reading this milk squirted out of my nose!

    Considering all the problems third-party devices are having, I'd say the certification process is a joke. Or the law is a joke. It's clearly missing something important if there are all these issues. Why else would an installer being 5 CableCards with the hope that one of them will work? Why do people have to play CSR roulette just to find someone who knows what they are doing? (sarcasm alert!)

    And I'm sure the tuning adapter has gone through the same rigorous certification process as the CableCards have. Oh wait....

    If all the cable companies boxes have to use the same CableCard and SDV, how come they can do so flawlessly yet Tivo continues to have problems? (sarcasm alert!)

    The main reason people don't like Tivo anymore is they don't want to be in the middle of all the finger pointing. They just want something that works, and one phone number to call when it doesn't work. Just getting a Tivo to work at all has proven to be difficult for some people. Then there are all kinds of tricks people do, like power cycling the tuning adapter so the guide can get updated and suggestions can (kind of) work. When you throw in the spontaneous reboots, lack of a complete HD GUI, no VOD, sluggishness, no cheap whole-house solution, etc., it ends up being not much better that the cable company's DVR. Add the fact that when it breaks you have to BUY a new one ($$$) and go through the whole thing all over again, and people just don't want to bother with it.

    It's sad, and a catch-22. Very few people care, so the issues never get fixed, so people don't buy Tivos, which mean even fewer people will care, etc.
     
  9. May 30, 2013 #69 of 189
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

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    John's...
    They don't.

    Partly because the FCC either refuses to enforce their regulations or believes the song and dance show when the Cable cos. claim they are in compliance.

    Beyond some minimal requirements, there are no standards for SDV access.
     
  10. May 30, 2013 #70 of 189
    dianebrat

    dianebrat I refuse to accept your reality TCF Club

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    boston'ish
    So how come many of us have ZERO problems? the issue isn't CableCARDs or the certification process, the problem is the CableCo's that have fought CC all the way and still don't have a decent process in place to activate them. Even Verizon which has done very well, has issues, calling a CSR to activate a CableCARD is hit or miss as to if it happens properly, but if we call in and do the automated process entering the numbers ourselves it works fine. Clearly CableCARDS work fine since the new cable boxes all have them, the reason they work is they take the CSR process out of the picture since they're treated as closed systems with no need to pair and activate manually, they just press a button and it's done for them.

    The issue here has never been Tivo or the Cable Labs certification process, it's ALWAYS been the MSO's
     
  11. May 30, 2013 #71 of 189
    Richard Cranium

    Richard Cranium New Member

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    Mar 28, 2010
    DING!! DING!!!

    WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!:up:
     
  12. May 30, 2013 #72 of 189
    Richard Cranium

    Richard Cranium New Member

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    I'll say it again....

    There are thousands of threads on this site alone that complain about the same issues (lookups, reboots, etc) they are not all from the same MSO. As a matter of fact there's probably a poblem with TiVo and EVERY MSO IN THE COUNTRY!

    Anybody want to guess what the constant denominator is?

    If your product has issues with EVERY MSO it might be time stop looking for black helicopters and to start blaming your product.

    Seriously, the MSO's are not out to get ya, they have plenty of people that use their products without a problem, they don't need to sabotage the last couple of die hards and geeks. :p

    Just saying....:rolleyes:
     
  13. May 30, 2013 #73 of 189
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    In my experience with cable cards with Comcast and FiOS it was always a matter of getting a tech that knew the correct person to get in contact with. And then the correct info had to also be relayed and also had to be input correctly. If you didn't have the proper person, or the number was read wrong, or it was input wrong, there were always issues.

    With the FiOS automated process you take out all the middle people and get the info and input it yourself. Which in my use lead to no issues when I paired my cable cards last year. Which seemed like a breath of fresh air compared to the old way of pairing the cable cards.
     
  14. May 30, 2013 #74 of 189
    Richard Cranium

    Richard Cranium New Member

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    Mar 28, 2010
    I had no problems pairing my CC with neither Cablevision or FIOS and that's exactly why I don't understand how it's the MSO's fault your 3rd party equipment locks up and reboots, misses recordings, sluggish performance...
     
  15. May 30, 2013 #75 of 189
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    I agree. However, using the cable co's DVR isn't always trouble free. They also have to be rebooted occasionally and have problems that require more than one truck roll to fix.

    Given the complexities involved in devising a third-party generic DVR system (e.g., TiVo) to work with digital cable, and SDV, it could be viewed as somewhat fortunate that TiVo is still available at all. It required the government forcing a (non free market) solution for which it doesn't have the horsepower to enforce trouble-free operation. (And I'm glad it doesn't -- we can't afford even more government).
     
  16. May 30, 2013 #76 of 189
    atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Active Member

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    Rochester NY
    The reality is, it is very very hard for the average person to have any idea where the problem is when he/she has one. Just too many pieces that can have issues and with multiple players providing those different pieces it becomes a support nightmare for everyone when something goes wrong and the problem isn't clearly identifiable.

    I long ago stopped recommend TiVo to anyone other than OTA only people as I have no desire to provide free support. That is why in my opinion Stand Alone TiVos are and will remain a niche product and TiVo's best hope is partnering with MSOs.

    What I find funny is we really don't hear much from people who rent TiVo DVRs from MSOs. After all they are the same TiVo DVRS that some people have so many issues when they buy them.
     
  17. May 30, 2013 #77 of 189
    dianebrat

    dianebrat I refuse to accept your reality TCF Club

    10,115
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    boston'ish
    no, we don't, we just have someone that agrees with your opinion so you get to jump up and down in "victory"
     
  18. May 30, 2013 #78 of 189
    bantar

    bantar Member

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  19. May 30, 2013 #79 of 189
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Nevada
    Those sorts of things are TiVo issues, at least most of the time. The one exception is the Tuning Adapter. TiVo has to stay in constant communication with the TA via USB. If it locks up or becomes sluggish then it can, by proxy, lock up the TiVo or make the TiVo sluggish. Most of the time the companies that manufacture these TAs know about the issues and create firmware patches to fix them, but a lot of the MSOs choose not to upgrade the firmware of the boxes they have in the field. Either because they want to hinder the experience or they simply don't care. And this particular problem is not specific to TiVo. There are a ton of HTPC users with Ceton cards that have the exact same issues when connected to a TA.

    If you want to fall in line and pay the cable company $20/mo for their ****ty DVR that you can't upgrade, then go ahead. But the FCC has mandated that they support 3rd party solutions via CableCARDs and some of them, not all, are purposely trying to hinder that experience. TWC was even fined once for making their hindrance of CableCARDs so blatantly obvious. So acting like they're innocent and it's all the technology's fault is just ignorant.
     
  20. May 30, 2013 #80 of 189
    Richard Cranium

    Richard Cranium New Member

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    Mar 28, 2010
    I don't look at it as a "victory" at all. I havent posted my "opinon", Ive posted my EXPEIRENCE with TiVo and 3 different MSO's. The FACT is that I happened to share the same problems the OP and THOUSANDS of others here.

    My "OPINION" is the Premeire is a bug ridden POS that was rushed out the door half baked and 5 years later is not much better than Beta ready.

    Look at me as someone that posts facts without getting emotional about their "investment" cause we both know I'm not the only one that had/has issues with the Premiere.

    72,000 subs (and counting) in a years time didn't walk away from their TiVo's because they were working "flawlessly" :eek:

    And that's a FACT not OPINION.
     

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