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Drive Expansion and Drive Upgrade FAQ

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by bkdtv, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. Nov 20, 2013 #9741 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    Oct 22, 2002
    As I said, I used dd. The file is 250GB. Having gotten a backup of the internal drive I figured there was probably little downside to using it some more. Sequentially reading the whole drive seems to have been good for it as its still running without error.

    I am not really concerned about getting the extra 250GB from the Seagate, I'd just like to to spin when I hook it up to my TiVo. You think there is an hdparm setting that I need to tweek?
     
  2. Nov 20, 2013 #9742 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    No, what we do is use

    hdparm

    to create a Host Protected Area on the 500GB drive that makes it look like it has the exact same LBA number as the stock 250, then

    dd

    the image to it, so that we don't run into a problem with the problem of an external causing a problem if the total drive space used is greater than original internal + external.

    Speaking of HPA's, you aren't using a GigaByte brand motherboard, are you?

    But first, if you didn't already run Seagate's long test before putting that 500 into service, do it now.

    And while you've got the TiVo opened, eyeball the power supply capacitors very closely for the slightest hint of bulging.
     
  3. Nov 20, 2013 #9743 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    Oct 22, 2002
    I actually did try booting the S3 with the external drive disconnected and got the same result. I don't know if that means anything.

    Ok, so we want to resize the drive so it looks like a 250GB drive. You want to suggest the correct incantation?

    It seems like this could be done after the dd since the metadata in the drive is not writable by normal I/O.

    My PC is a Dell, I assume they use their own motherboard.
     
  4. Nov 20, 2013 #9744 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    Oct 22, 2002
    Ok, I spent enough time pawing through the man pages and it seems I want:
    hdparm -N 488386584 --yes-i-know-what-i-am-doing /dev/sdb
     
  5. Nov 20, 2013 #9745 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

    31
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    Oct 22, 2002
    That had no effect, the drive still does not spin up when I put it in the S3. Are there any other parameters I should check?
     
  6. Nov 20, 2013 #9746 of 10248
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

    8,081
    2
    May 6, 2002
    John's...
    If the drive does not even spin up, then the drive configuration is not the problem. I would suspect a power supply problem. Take a look at the caps on the ps and see if any of them are bulging.
     
  7. Nov 20, 2013 #9747 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    Oct 22, 2002
    I don't see any bulging. The old drive works just fine. The new drive pull less than 1/3 of the power of the old drive.
     
  8. Nov 20, 2013 #9748 of 10248
    jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

    1,558
    10
    Jan 1, 2009
    Not sure where you got your drive from but I'll give you my experience with another Seagate AV drive. I bought one version that was retail bulk that worked flawlessly. The other one I bought off of an online auction that advertise as new. To make a long story short, the drive was new but was designed for a particular satellite box. The drive would spin up only on my newest computer attached as a SATA drive from boot. It would not spin up if used as an ESATA drive plugged in after boot. It would not work on my older computer at all and would not spin up on the TiVo at all. After multiple calls with Seagate support, the drive had a modified firmware that was designed for the satellite box it was destined for. They would not give me the retail firmware for the drive. Consequently I returned it. Don't know if this applies to you but I thought I would share the experience.
     
  9. Nov 21, 2013 #9749 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    The LBA number for the two WD 250GB drives I've seen in the two 648s I've had my hands on (WD2500BS-55RPB1) is

    488397168

    and you left something out of that command line as well.

    So I hope no one else saw it and tried to use it before I got here.

    What's the model number on the 250 in your 648?
     
  10. Nov 21, 2013 #9750 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    Oct 22, 2002
    Interesting. I got it on Amazon. Sold by Eonline. Anyway to tell if it has the stock firmware?
     
  11. Nov 21, 2013 #9751 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

    31
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    Oct 22, 2002
    I just cut the size in 1/2. I can try your number but I don't see how the HPA size would effect if the drive spins up or not.

    And what does "and you left something out of that command line as well" mean? Why be so cryptic?
     
  12. Nov 21, 2013 #9752 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    0
    Oct 22, 2002
    That seems like it was a good enough hint. While looking through the hdparm man page I noticed the -s "Power up in standby". Disabling that gets the drive to spin in my TiVo. The TiVo is not quite happy yet, so I guess Ill go back to fiddling with the HPA.

    Thanks!
     
  13. Nov 21, 2013 #9753 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    Oct 22, 2002
    The model of my stock drive is WD2500BS
     
  14. Nov 21, 2013 #9754 of 10248
    John Wilson

    John Wilson Member

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    Dec 30, 2001
    Chippewa...
    Well, I spent the last few DAYS copying off the shows that I wanted onto another TiVo HD. After that I put the original drive in the PC and made a truncated image .tbk. I then connected the new WD 2 TB drive WD20EURS and restored the truncated image with a swap size of 1024MB. It completed and I did not expand the drive at this time. I then installed that drive and powered it up to make sure everything was working. Good thing I did! It brought up the Powering Up... screen and then after a time it brought up the Almost there... screen. Looking good so far. I've done this on a number of other S2 and S3 models so I was feeling pretty confident that all was well. Then it re-booted back to the Powering Up... screen again. I said to myself "WTF?" Then I got the Green screen which basically states that "the DVR has detected a serious problem and is now attempting to fix it. This will take about 3 hours."

    Crap. I thought that maybe the truncated image wasn't correct so I pulled the plug, connected the original 1 TB drive to the PC, made another image and again restored it to the 2 TB drive. Same result. This is new territory for me so I'm looking for some help. Should I put the original 1 TB drive back in the TiVo and do a Clear & Delete and then make a new truncated image? Can I just delete the recordings or is a C&D necessary? What does the C&D do to my settings or Cable Card info? I did notice that the original 1 TB drive has 15 partitions but the restored 2 TB (before expanding) has only 14 partitions. Is this normal?

    What course of action should I take at this point using WinMFS?:confused::p
     
  15. Nov 21, 2013 #9755 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    I'll be glad to discuss

    hdparm

    options that are dangerous in beginner's hands in PMs, but I'm a little hesitant to do it out in the open.

    I've never used an external on a TiVo myself, but I've seen discussion either here or the mfslive.org site or both by people who know more about all of this than do I that says using an external limits you to using internals the same size as the one from the factory.

    The HPA trick is to make it look like it's the same size.

    Your original internal should have the LBA number on the label, which is the number you want to use, because that's the amount of space a restored image should fill, and that LBA number is the one you use with

    hdparm

    (it's whatever's left over that determines the size of the HPA)
     
  16. Nov 21, 2013 #9756 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC

    The restoration should produce the original 13 partitions and they should be the same size as on the original, installed at the factory, internal drive.

    (except for the swap partition)

    However, even with a 1GB swap, you aren't going to fill 2TBs, so there's going to be a 14th partition, which will be an Apple Free Partition, which is what the Apple Partition Map scheme labels free space that's not partitioned.

    When you go back to a larger than original drive with either MFS Live or WinMFS to expand, it takes that Apple Free Partition and turns it into an MFS pair, a small one that's an MFS Application region, and a big one that's an MFS Media region.

    WinMFS should run that 15th partition all the way out to the end of the drive--sometimes the MFS Live cd leaves a little bit of space that becomes a 16th partition of the Apple Free variety.

    Clear and delete everything will do just that--everything you've added since it left the factory will be wiped out and when it finishes and reboots it'll be at the start of Guided Setup and you have to go through all of that again.

    Run wdidle3.exe on that WD20EURS, just to be absolutely sure that Intellipark is disabled, then put it back and let it green screen overnight.

    By the time you can report the results of that, I'll have had some sleep.
     
  17. Nov 21, 2013 #9757 of 10248
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

    8,081
    2
    May 6, 2002
    John's...
    IIRC, there are problems trying to do what you are trying to do, i.e. using WinMFS to expand a previously expanded drive. You may be able to do it with JMFS using the instructions here, but I don't know for sure. Hopefully, someone with more knowledge about it will "speak" up. It would also require having both drives hooked up to the computer at the same time.

    P.S. I noticed unitron "spoke" up before I posted this, but I am going ahead anyway, just in case JMFS is a possibility.
     
  18. Nov 22, 2013 #9758 of 10248
    John Wilson

    John Wilson Member

    94
    0
    Dec 30, 2001
    Chippewa...
    Unitron,
    Thanks for your reply. I have great news; sometime between hours 2 and 2.5 (don't ask how I know ;) ) it rebooted and came up normally. All the settings were intact but there were no listings of the programs as usually happens when you have some recordings and you just restore from the backup image. I'm thinking it went through some kind of a C&D during the green screen. I didn't get around to running wdidle.exe as I was so excited to have a working
    drive. I connected one more time and did the mfsadd and then the supersize. It says it failed the supersize but when I checked the system info its reporting 318 HD hours ! wdidle.exe must have been enabled in this WD20EURS from the factory as I'm able to restart it with no issues.

    Project done. Thanks for the posts with suggestions. This Forum is the greatest!:D:up:
     
  19. Nov 22, 2013 #9759 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC

    Just to be picky, the "feature" is Intellipark, and wdidle3.exe is the utility with which one enables it/sets the timer period or disables it (which, if you have a particular WD green drive that won't let you disable Intellipark, can be done as far as a TiVo is concerned by setting the timer period to 300 seconds, which is 5 minutes).

    It's called the "Green Screen of Death" because of the old Microsoft DOS/Windows Blue Screen of Death, known as BSOD, but TiVo's green screen is actually a good thing because it's really the "green screen of 'give me some time to work through some issues I'm having' ", and for it to still be in good enough shape to be able to invoke the green screen in the first place is a good sign, and you should just let it alone for a while to work things out for itself.

    A solid, uniform gray screen with no letters or anything is a different matter, and indicates some kind of imperfect communication between the motherboard and the hard drive (multiple possible causes from loose cable to expensive to fix things), and requires a more active intervention.
     
  20. Nov 25, 2013 #9760 of 10248
    ubell

    ubell New Member

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    0
    Oct 22, 2002
    I would not think this forum is the novice, if you open the box you better know what you are doing.

    In any case, my problem was the drive being configured to power up in idle. With a fresh copy of the old image and a matching LBA all is well (I don't know which or both of those two was necessary.)

    As far as using an internal drive larger than the original with an external drive, I almost did an experiment with that, but decided my day job took priority. http://www.mfslive.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=811&p=6970#p6970
    I was tempted to try it now with the 500GB, but I spent too long trying to get it to spin.

    Thanks for your comments.
     

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