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Drive Expansion and Drive Upgrade FAQ

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by bkdtv, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. Feb 19, 2013 #9361 of 10248
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    I assume "running 11.0k" means the image you put on the 2TB drive is a WinMFS backup of a smaller drive that had 11.0k on it, correct?

    Does the same WinMFS-only procedure apply to the 652 model? In particular, if I start with a WinMFS backup of my current 1TB drive with 11.0k on it and upgrade to 2TB?
     
  2. Feb 19, 2013 #9362 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    If that 1TB drive does not have a 16th Apple Free partition on the end, you can use the jmfs cd to copy it byte for byte to the 2TB and then add a single MFS Media partition (for a total of 16, the limit per drive for a TiVo) to use the other 1TB.

    Or you could use WinMFS to copy the 1TB to the 2TB, preserving all of your recordings and settings, and, whether there's an Apple Free partition on the 1TB or not, use WinMFS to expand that 15th MFS Media partition to use the rest of that 2TB, which will give you a partition about 1.6TB in size.

    If you're already running 11.0k on that 1TB, it'll be able to handle a partition that large, whereas previously there was a 1.2TB limit.
     
  3. Feb 19, 2013 #9363 of 10248
    InFromTheCold

    InFromTheCold New Member

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    To your thinking, is there an advantage in doing it one way versus the other? (Spoken as a person who's still amazed & delighted that I managed to upgrade to 1TB using WinMFS -- if, given the above conditions, I could upgrade to 2TB using the method that worked for me before, I'll be happy to go that route.) And if this is truly an option, I'm sure my fellow followers of this thread would be interested in knowing that.
     
  4. Feb 19, 2013 #9364 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    I don't know enough to know if one way is better than the other.

    To me, the only advantage (once you've made sure there's no Apple Free partition about which to worry) is that WinMFS will let you expand the size of the swap partition as part of the copying process.

    Which I can't say for sure is worth the bother or not, but a 1GB swap partition is only about 15 minutes of video, so I consider it cheap insurance.

    But plenty of people have used jmfs on their Premieres and S3 HDs and left the swap partition the same size as on the stock drive and as far as we know it hasn't hurt them any.

    And of course if you have a Premiere, none of the above matters because your only choice is to use jmfs to copy the original drive.
     
  5. Feb 19, 2013 #9365 of 10248
    InFromTheCold

    InFromTheCold New Member

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    Thanks. In my case, I'm strictly in THD country. I'm at the point where I've determined that the EARX drive that replaced my RMA'd drive is ship-shape, now I just need to carve out a stretch of time to dismantle the Tivo and do the copying. I'll report back on that other thread when I do, just b/c I started the conversation there.
     
  6. Feb 20, 2013 #9366 of 10248
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    I'm not that concerned with saving my current recordings. (I mainly use TiVo for short term time shifting rather than archival storage.) I did my 1TB expansion with WinMFS using a truncated backup from the original 160GB drive via a (single) USB-SATA cable (thus avoiding messing with sata connections on my PC motherboard). If I'm willing to lose my recordings can I do this as follows:

    1. Make truncated back up of current (11.0k) 1 TB drive using WinMFS (and USB-SATA cable).
    2. Use WinMFS (and USB-SATA cable) to put that backup on the 2 TB drive.
    3. Supersize using WinMFS.

    Or does your recipe work only if both old and new drive are connected to PC at the same time (as required when WinMFS copies recordings over)? This of course isn't practical using USB-SATA adapters because it takes forever to copy the recordings.

    Just a reminder in case context has been lost by now: My tivo is a 652.
     
  7. Feb 20, 2013 #9367 of 10248
    jonapt

    jonapt New Member

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    Can't offer an opinion on jmfs, have never used it.

    I know the old paradigm was nothing >1.2TB would work but do we know for sure there is something 'wrong' with the 15th partition being 1.6TB?

    If the 648 only uses 1.2TB of the 1.6TB assigned I wouldn't be able to tell because Tivo provides no usage statistics on storage. OTOH, if the 648 goes down hard when recordings exceed 1.2TB I'll found out next week...

    My .tbk was 11.0g and three days later it is still 11.0g, so 11.0k is not essential to assign partitions on a 2TB drive with WinMFS.

    I doubt that swap space is a consideration, but I set the swap size to 512MB, and partition 15 was assigned at 1.6TB.

    My plan was to force a kickstart to get upgraded to 11.0k but will leave it as-is and wait to see what happens next week when 11.0g has to recover storage to record new programs.

    If it turns out that 11.0k does have 'magic' then replacing the 11.0g at dropbox with an 11.0k would be a good idea.

    That may not work because when I expanded to the 1 TB drive, WinMFS assigned an Apple partition. My concern was that a pre-existing Apple partition would prevent WinMFS successfully expanding to a 2 TB drive. My goal was to prevent creation of an Apple partition, which is why I started with a virgin .tbk and went the MFSadd plus MFS SuperSize route. You don't need 11.0k to get to a 2 TB drive. My Tivo is a 648, but the same procedure should work just as well on a 652.
     
  8. Feb 20, 2013 #9368 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Supersize is not the same as expand.

    Supersize undoes the "save x amount of space for the adds and showcases and such that gets either sent down the intarwebs or copied from the all-paid programming cable channel in the middle of the night".

    In your case as long as you don't mind losing the recordings you can make a backup with WinMFS, then restore it to the 2TB, don't accept when it offers to expand, test it in the TiVo, then hook it back to the PC, launch WinMFS and click on mfsadd to use the entire drive, and then use WinMFS to supersize.

    Or you could watch up and delete all of your recordings, make a full backup with the MFS Live cd v1.4, restore that to the 2TB with MFS Live, test it in the TiVo, and then use WinMFS to mfsadd and supersize.

    Your choice. Second version might save the opening animation or something. Not my area of expertise.
     
  9. Feb 20, 2013 #9369 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Are my 652 images in the "don't PM me" thread only 11.0g?

    I didn't really notice when I made them, but the 652 I got had been down with capacitor plague for a while (which is how I got it for just shipping), so I guess it's possible.

    I may have to look into doing something about it if I get a long stretch of "nothing to do but catch up on old business" time.

    Should be possible to restore it to a 2TB without expanding, run it in the TiVo long enough to both test and get updated to 11.0k, and then expand.

    I don't think a 1.6TB Apple Free partition will bother it since it won't be trying to use it.
     
  10. Feb 21, 2013 #9370 of 10248
    jonapt

    jonapt New Member

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    I'm a 648, it is dlsl who has the 652. It is the 648s at dropbox which are 11.0g

    Since a 648 has more issues than the 652 I wanted to avoid the Apple partition to boost my chances of success.
     
  11. Feb 21, 2013 #9371 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    I don't know that the 648 necessarily has issues to a greater extent than the 652.

    jmfs can see 652 drives but not 648 drives for some reason, but I see that as a shortcoming of jmfs (although since I don't know how it works I could be wrong, and anyway it was never intended to deal with any S3 model).


    The Apple Free partition is only a problem when trying to use jmfs to do an upgrade of an upgrade, WinMFS eats 'em for lunch.

    I put that 648 image up there before actually owning or ever getting my hands on a 648.

    Now that I have one I'm putting into service I'll try to put an 11.0k image in it's place as soon as I can.
     
  12. Feb 21, 2013 #9372 of 10248
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    Thanks, but I'm confused about the "... test it in the TiVo..." step before doing the mfsadd step. Is this necessary because running it in the TiVo changes something on the drive that's needed before mfsadd? Or is it really to "test" something? What is it testing -- and -- what if the "test" fails? (Also, if the "test" requires filling the 1TB to see what happens, then it will take a long time.)
     
  13. Feb 21, 2013 #9373 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Think of it as a belt and suspenders approach.

    Unless you need to run it before expansion in order to get it to phone home and get updated to 11.0k, then it's not about the TiVo changing anything on it, and I suppose it wouldn't be absolutely necessary, but if you don't do it that way and it doesn't work, how do you know if the problem was in the original restoration or in the expansion?

    It's kind of like the approach to troubleshooting and diagnosis--change only one thing at a time and see what happens.

    As for testing it in the TiVo, just hook it up to the cable harness, let it hang out the back of the open chassis, plug it in the wall, see if it boots up, check your now playing list, play a little of the oldest and newest recordings, change channels a few times, call it good, tell it to restart, pull the cord just as it does, and do the expansion.

    Then test it again the same way, if all seems well, shut down the same way, then actually re-install the drive bracket with the drive attached, hook it up, plug it in, check the usual, shut down, put the lid back on, call it done.
     
  14. Feb 21, 2013 #9374 of 10248
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    OK, I get it. I suspect the fun really starts when it doesn't work right after one of the steps -- but I will hope that doesn't happen.
     
  15. Feb 22, 2013 #9375 of 10248
    dianebrat

    dianebrat I refuse to accept your reality TCF Club

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    Followup to a question I asked in another thread now that it looks like 11.0k can handle 2TB drives.

    I have a clean 250GB original 648 drive, I have no problem putting it in the box and getting it up to 11.0k.

    Is the takeaway that with 11.0k I can then use WinMFS to copy and then expand and it'll use the 2.0TB? I would love to get rid of my dual 1TB drives and remove the external case.
     
  16. Feb 22, 2013 #9376 of 10248
    mattack

    mattack Active Member

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    Can you provide a link and/or more information? Are you claiming that Tivos now handle bigger drives? From what to what? (I presume you mean 'to 2 TB', but I thought people have been using 2 TB drives fully for a long time.)
     
  17. Feb 22, 2013 #9377 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    The big deal here is that you can do it with a 648 as well as a 652, and you don't need jmfs, WinMFS can handle it all, because 11.0k will handle a partition over 1.2TB in size.
     
  18. Feb 22, 2013 #9378 of 10248
    dianebrat

    dianebrat I refuse to accept your reality TCF Club

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    The TivoHD has been able to do 2TB on a single drive since JMFS was found to work on it, the catch was always that the original 648/OLED S3 was not able to go that high and topped at 1.2TB for a single drive. This thread and the comment by Unitron in another thread pointed out that with 11.0k (and possibly 11.0g) you can expand a 648 image to 2TB, that's a huge step forward for me, I'd been keeping an eye out for this discussion for a while but this was the first I'd heard of it.
     
  19. Feb 22, 2013 #9379 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    That whole issue was complicated by jmfs being able, for whatever reason, to detect an S3 HD (652) drive as a TiVo drive, but not the 648 (original OLED display S3) drive.

    EDIT: Okay, maybe not complicated exactly, so much as the confusion was added to by "jmfs being able..."
     
  20. Feb 22, 2013 #9380 of 10248
    mattack

    mattack Active Member

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    I have no Windows… So obviously can't use WinMFS.

    Oh, so you're saying that jmfs now works with OLED S3? That's good to know (though my OLED is currently dead).
     

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