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Drive Expansion and Drive Upgrade FAQ

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by bkdtv, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. Jul 8, 2012 #8741 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    I couldn't resist, and just ordered a WD20EURS to test Lussie's instructions out with. I'm pretty sure it's an advanced format drive like most new drives, but I like that I'll know it's as quiet as can be and comes with a 3-year warranty.

    I've only got USB2, so it's likely to take a very long time to copy my current 1TB over, but I'll follow the steps exactly and report back with my results. The drive should get here mid-week, so if things go smoothly I may be able to report back at the end of the week or over the weekend. *gulp*
     
  2. Jul 8, 2012 #8742 of 10248
    hummingbird_206

    hummingbird_206 Active Member

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  3. Jul 8, 2012 #8743 of 10248
    Lussie

    Lussie New Member

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    I super-sized it using WinMFS. (both on the S3 and the TivoHD) Sorry, I missed that step in the original post. I just edited it. :)

    Also, that Hitachi drive seems to be as quiet as the old 1TB Cinemastars that were replaced.

    BTW: I initially tried to copy using USB 2.0. That took almost 16 hours, after that I decided to buy a USB 3.0 card for my laptop after making about 16 tries at this. The card is a Silverstone Tek Slim ExpressCard/34 USB 3.0 ExpressCard Adapter (Amazon: EC02) Unfortunately, this USB 3.0 card was not recognized in the Linux ISO's. Nor does it work on any Linux virtual machines I was testing (VMware and Oracle VirtualBox) Seems to only work with Windows7.

    Two things to keep in mind:
    • With the S3. JMFS does not seem to recognize the old S3 (OLED display, Not a TivoHD) 1 TB drive as a Tivo drive. It just says there are No Tivo Drives connected.
    • Manually removing the partition 16 (Apple_Free) with iBored is kind of a pain, but I think that's the secret sauce. :)

    Cheers,
    -Kevin
     
  4. Jul 8, 2012 #8744 of 10248
    Lussie

    Lussie New Member

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    S3-2501: Please use caution with an AF drive.

    I'm not 100% sure that old hardware like the S3 can handle an AF drive even if it is in compatibility mode. Make sure it is returnable.

    BTW: You can tell a non-AF drive if the block size is 512.

    Let us know your results.

    Cheers,
    -Kevin
     
  5. Jul 8, 2012 #8745 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    Thanks for the quick answer and update! I can't wait to give this a try!:)

    Edit: Yeah, I know AF is a risk, but I haven't read any real-world reports here of other Tivo models having definitive issues with them and I really wanted to stick with the WD AV drive series. I ordered it from Amazon, so I should be able to return it if I need to, and if not I may just use it to upgrade a relative's TivoHD.

    I still can't wait to see if it works though. It's been very annoying lately having to police who's recording what in HD to keep the drive from filling up too fast!
     
  6. Jul 8, 2012 #8746 of 10248
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    Doesn't this drive require running wdidle to disable intellipark? And I don't think wdidle can run using a USB connection, correct?
     
  7. Jul 8, 2012 #8747 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    It's correct that wdidle can only be run when the drive is connected to a motherboard. I've installed 3 WD AV drives in 3 different Tivos. I ran wdidle on the first one as a precaution. The other two were installed first and they passed the hard and soft reboot tests without any issue so I didn't bother running it later. I'll take the same approach with this drive and only bother with wdidle if the thing won't boot after competing the upgrade.

    I mentioned that I only had USB2 since at the moment I plan to do the actual disk transfer by USB (more convenient for me) and I don't have any USB3 ports to transfer with as Lussie ultimately did. I do have access to a desktop PC motherboard with SATA connections if needed (or if I lose patience with the USB approach to the transfer;) ). Sorry for any confusion.
     
  8. Jul 12, 2012 #8748 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    I'll post more details later, but right now I'm cautiously optimistic that I have successfully upgraded my S3 to 2TB using a WD20EURS and by following Lussie's instructions. The Tivo reports the full 318 HD hours and all old recordings and settings appear intact. More information to follow when I get a chance to sit down and compose a more thorough post (which I hope will be sometime over the next few days.)
     
  9. Jul 12, 2012 #8749 of 10248
    hummingbird_206

    hummingbird_206 Active Member

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    Great! I'm looking forward to the details. I think I'm going to give it a try this weekend.

    Did you use an external USB drive or connect to the MB? Did you have to run wdidle? Did I mention I'm looking forward to the details?:eek:
     
  10. Jul 13, 2012 #8750 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    I'm just starting to write it all out. I'll do my best to post it sometime on Saturday if at all possible.

    To answer your two specific questions: I used a motherboard connection,via an eSATA adapter bracket, and since I went that route I did go ahead and run wdidle. Stay tuned. ;)
     
  11. Jul 13, 2012 #8751 of 10248
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    Another question of interest is the heat generation of the Hitachi drive. Could you please post your internal TiVo temperature? (And what it was before the upgrade, if you know it.)
     
  12. Jul 13, 2012 #8752 of 10248
    hummingbird_206

    hummingbird_206 Active Member

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    Great, thank you!
     
  13. Jul 13, 2012 #8753 of 10248
    hummingbird_206

    hummingbird_206 Active Member

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    I think S3-2501 used the WD drive, not the Hitachi. Are you looking for temps on the WD drive or the Hitachi?
     
  14. Jul 13, 2012 #8754 of 10248
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    Oops! I should have asked Lussie that question. I know WD drives are OK on the heat issue.
     
  15. Jul 14, 2012 #8755 of 10248
    hummingbird_206

    hummingbird_206 Active Member

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    I used Lussie's instructions and the WD20EURS and was pretty successful. I used the dual docking station, but plugged in to USB 2.0 since I don't have 3.0 on my computer.

    It took 7.5 hours to copy from 1T Hitachi to 2T WD.

    I did not run wdidle and S3 booted fine. Did a restart from the menu, and restarted with no problem.

    However, ended up with 213 hours of HD recording time using the 2T drive. Old 1T drive had 157 hours. I did the supersize step. Not sure why I didn't get 318 hours? But overall I'm very happy. Preserved ~60 hours of HD shows and the WD drive is much quieter than the Hitachi drive was.

    Thank you Lussie for those instructions. Awesome!
    Thank you S3-2501 for listing the WD hard drive.
     
  16. Jul 14, 2012 #8756 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    Ok, here are the upgrade details that I promised. This may be more detail than necessary, but I’d rather give too much detail than too little. Sorry if it’s all a bit dry, but it’s not exactly light reading to begin with.

    The Tivo being upgraded is an original Series 3 with orange OLED front panel. My source drive was a WD10EVCS drive purchased from Weaknees that’s been in use for a few years now (manufacture date 11/19/08.) My upgrade drive is a WD20EURS manufactured 6/20/12. The label clearly states that it is an advanced format drive and gives jumper and alignment instructions for Windows XP users that end in “All other OS configurations – drive is ready to use as is.” No jumpers were placed on the drive. I’m running Windows 7 Professional 64-bit on my PC. I don’t know if this is relevant, but the Tivo is used with OTA signals only, so there are no cable card or tuning adapter issues to worry about in this case.

    Anxious to get things moving along, I decided to connect the drives directly to my computer’s motherboard via an expansion slot bracket that converts two of the onboard SATA ports into two eSATA ports on the bracket. The 1TB source drive was placed in an enclosure with eSATA capability, and the 2TB drive was left bare but installed on the Tivo’s mounting bracket and connected via a SATA to eSATA adapter.

    Before starting the upgrade, I used a bootable USB stick with wdidle3 on it and ran wdidle3 /r to check the status of the new drive. It reported that the “timer is disabled” so no changes were made.

    Mfscopy took almost exactly 4 hours 56 minutes. I was a bit concerned when the ETA timer went bananas near the end and started displaying some insanely long number for the time remaining. Thanks to clearly active HDD lights, I just let it go and thankfully it finished without issue.

    The iBored step is where things got weird. I got to block 16 and found the “Apple Partition Map:AMP Entry” template fine, but when I selected BlockView->Make Writable I got an error that there was no disk found (similar to the error from back in the day when attempting to access a floppy drive with no disk in it.) The error reappeared when I clicked the various options presented on the error dialog, but after several tries it eventually did go away.

    I selected Make Writable again, and when no error reappeared, I attempted to erase the block. Despite the drive being an AF drive, iBored reported the block size as 512. I took a picture of this with my camera, and only later when I looked at the picture did I notice a downward arrow to the right of the 512 indicating that I may have been able to select 4K as an option. So when deleting block 16, the block size was set to the default 512. I configured the rest of the block range dialog per the instructions and deleted block 16. For some reason I did have to re-start iBored to refresh the block view and confirm that block 16 was in fact deleted.

    Now I had to change the “blocks in partition map” to 15 for all 15 remaining partitions. The problem was, I couldn’t find the “blocks in partition map” field. After some tinkering, I realized that to see that field, you must be sure that for each block you first click the Template tab and then select “Apple Partition Map:AMP Entry” from the drop down box.

    It’s worth noting that I got the same disk not found error when I went to change the first “blocks in partition map” field, but once again after I got the error to go away I was able to retry without the error reoccurring. I then successfully changed the value for all 15 blocks.

    One thing that threw me for a minute was that block 1 isn’t the lowest value block on the drive. I accidentally hit CTRL+LeftArrow one too many times and inadvertently selected to view block 0, the values on which made it look like I had seriously messed things up. Thankfully I spotted my error before I did any damage and I proceeded to confirm that “blocks in partition map” was set to 15 for all 15 remaining blocks.

    I opened WinMFS, did mfsadd and turned on supersize. I then saved the final mfsinfo data before installing the drive in the Tivo. If people think they can derive useful information from the final partition or zone information, let me know and I can post that separately.

    An important note before I go any further: While I had the cover off the Tivo, I checked the power supply capacitors for signs of the dreaded bulging. I have never had any rebooting or other issues with this Tivo and the existing 1TB drive, but I did see that one capacitor was indeed bulging enough to be noticed. If I start having reboot issues in the near future, I would replace the capacitor or the entire power supply before I would have any confidence that the upgrade or the advanced format drive is at fault. Let’s hope that’s not necessary in the near future though!

    OK, so the moment of truth came and the Tivo booted fine. I checked the System Information screen, confirmed that it reported all 318 hours of HD recording space, and then verified that my old recordings were preserved and played properly. I did notice a slight delay in the sound effects and button response when I first attempted trick play with live TV, but within seconds that stopped completely and everything seemed normal.

    I let the TiVo run for about 12 hours, during which time I had it connect to Tivo, stream and download from the Video on Demand menu and even transferred a show from another Tivo. In my limited use during those 12 hours or so, the only thing that seemed even remotely amiss was that menus and the guide seemed to be slower by up to a few seconds.

    After those 12 hours, I soft-rebooted the Tivo to make sure that the information from wdidle3 was accurate. It soft-rebooted without issue.

    Since that time, the menus have gotten closer to normal speed, though as I type this there are still occasions when they seem a touch slower. Accessing the To Do list has the most noticeable delay. Otherwise, so far it’s still happily recording away and I’m enjoying the new surplus of free space.

    The System Information screen reports that the internal temperature is no warmer than it was with the old drive. The current temp reading is 46 degrees. As best as I can recall, the temperature with the old drive would approach 49 degrees at most.

    In closing, I’d be remiss if I didn’t give a huge thanks to Lussie/Kevin for figuring all this out! His instructions were remarkably well done and easy to follow. Everyone looking to max out the capacity on their original S3 Tivo owes him a debt of gratitude!:up::)
     
  17. Jul 14, 2012 #8757 of 10248
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    S3-2501, go ahead and replace the caps on the +5V and +12V outputs and be done with it.

    They'll be the ones with their + leads connected directly to the red or yellow wires (via the copper "lands" on the underside of the board) and their - leads connected directly to the black wires.

    Did you use the WinMFS mfscopy or the MFS Live cd one?

    What about swap partition size?
     
  18. Jul 14, 2012 #8758 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    Unfortunately, I don't have the knowledge or skillset to do the replacement myself, and I don't want to part with the Tivo right now to bring it to an electronics repair shop since it seems to be working fine at the moment. I agree though, if I were able to do it myself quickly, I would have done it right away.


    Everything was done using WinMFS and iBored, exactly as outlined in Lussie's instructions.

    Following Lussie's instructions, I unchecked "Custom Linux Swap Size" and did check "No Optimized Partition Layout" before starting the copy. So whatever that does to the swap partition is what the Tivo has now.
     
  19. Jul 14, 2012 #8759 of 10248
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    When you were done removing block 16 and modifying the blocks in partition map fields with iBored, did you go back into WinMFS and select Tools -> MFSadd before you turned on supersize? MFSadd is what expands the usable space to the rest of the disk, so if you accidentally skipped that step that could be the cause of the discrepancy.
     
  20. Jul 14, 2012 #8760 of 10248
    hummingbird_206

    hummingbird_206 Active Member

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    Thanks for helping me try to figure it out. I did do the MFSadd and got the warning about TiVo no handling partitions great than 1 TB. Then after that I did the MFSSupersize.
     

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