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Drive Expansion and Drive Upgrade FAQ

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by bkdtv, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. Mar 23, 2010 #5401 of 10248
    LockRob

    LockRob New Member

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    Aug 24, 2003
    I would like to see them support the one they say is supported. When I had to ask a question of a Tivo rep (about a 1 terabyte WD "My DVR Expander" he questioned whether it was a supported model. He said (something like) "Just because it says Tivo compatible on the box, doesn't mean it is"
    OH, well...and that is why I bought that particular drive. I got it working after an initial bump in the road.
     
  2. Mar 23, 2010 #5402 of 10248
    Phantom Gremlin

    Phantom Gremlin New Member

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    Jun 20, 2002
    Tualatin,...
    I finally got around to upgrading two TiVo HD boxes to larger internal capacity. The instructions in the first post are great. Thanks.

    However, I ran into a problem, which took me a few minutes to figure out and solve. This may stump some newbies, so I think it needs to go into the first post.

    Summary: If you put a newly expanded drive into a different TiVo, you must perform a Clear & delete everything at your first opportunity. This information is nowhere in the first post, and yet it is needed by people who are replacing dead drives, rather than just upgrading the same box with a larger capacity drive.

    For the record, in case someone searches after similar problems, here's the long backstory ...

    I bought two new Hitachi 1 TB drives from Fry's (drives discussed a few days ago). They work fine. I ran through Hitachi's Drive Fitness Test to verify basic functionality and I used Hitachi's Feature Tool to set the acoustic level. I used WinMFS without problems.

    I put the first new drive back into the TiVo HD the original drive came from, and had no problems upon restart. I had 157 hours of HD capacity, my season passes were intact, my recorded programs were there.

    The second drive was the problem. I put it into a different TiVo HD. You would think that the software would recognize that it's connected to a different motherboard, and give a clear error message. Or you would think that the software would figure out what happened and fix itself. But you would be wrong.

    Instead, TiVo chose the lazy alternative of "half-assed" working. The system boots, but then behaves badly. Some functions work, e.g. you can see that you have 157 hours of capacity, you can set your network address and connect to the TiVo service, you can change your channel lineup. But other functions don't work.

    After you boot up, you see a message that tells you that a hardware problem occured, and you must reboot your machine. Ignore that. Nothing changes if you reboot.

    The key is "Error #51". A quick search at TiVo Community tells you that you moved a drive to a different system, and so you must Clear & delete everything to start anew. Simple and effective.
     
  3. Mar 23, 2010 #5403 of 10248
    mchief

    mchief Morey

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    Sep 10, 2005
    Alexandria, VA
    I give up - What did you do to the SECOND HD. If you used MFSlive to copy BOTH drives from ONE ORIGINAL, then you would have probems. Otherwise your problems/comments make no sense.
     
  4. Mar 23, 2010 #5404 of 10248
    cjv2

    cjv2 New Member

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    Dec 15, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Uh, Didn't TiVo sell that expander on the TiVo website at one point? And market it as "the only one supported?"
     
  5. Mar 23, 2010 #5405 of 10248
    lex3001

    lex3001 New Member

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    Feb 13, 2005
    According to TiVo, 11.0d is the latest. You can't request anything with the priority update feature.

    http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/311

    So maybe this isn't widely available yet, if indeed it is available at all? I'll force a connect anyway ;-)
     
  6. Mar 23, 2010 #5406 of 10248
    cjv2

    cjv2 New Member

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    Dec 15, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
    Somewhere buried in some thread in the forum is a note from a VP of product development at Tivo that indicates it's not only available but should be out to all users within a month (or by the end of the month, I forget which). The post made no reference to Intellipark though, so couldn't tell you whether it addresses the issue.
     
  7. Mar 23, 2010 #5407 of 10248
    Phantom Gremlin

    Phantom Gremlin New Member

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    Jun 20, 2002
    Tualatin,...
    Yes of course that's what I did. Sorry to be unclear. Two reasons:

    1) the 2nd TiVo had previously been screwed up and flaky (it's working now with the new disk). I believe the flakiness happened because a bad WD DVR expander hosed the internal disk. Others have reported this problem (external screws up internal). That's why I didn't want to use its original disk. So I needed a known good image. Clearly, using the image from the 1st TiVo was much cheaper than paying $40 for InstantCake.

    2) Even if the 2nd TiVo's original disk were OK, it would have been more work to use it as a source than to just make a second copy from the file that WinMFS saved.

    My point is that Clear & delete everything takes care of this situation. IMO this isn't an uncommon scenario and that's why it belongs in the first post of this thread.
     
  8. Mar 23, 2010 #5408 of 10248
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
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    Jan 4, 2003
    One more item of note is that IIRC you're on VZ FIOS. VZ doesn't pair cable cards (to TiVo or TV's) but all other cableco's do. If you were to run a C&DE prior to a regular upgrade it would be akin to creating a brand new TiVo as it will erase all Season Passes, WishLists and cable card settings. Just wanted to clarify in case someone stumbles across the info regarding your two-TiVo upgrade and fails to read the fine print.

    Glad to hear things are working well now. Those Hitachi's are quickly becoming my drive of choice. Enjoy!
     
  9. Mar 23, 2010 #5409 of 10248
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

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    Jan 4, 2003
    TiVo initially distributes updates to a select, small number of boxes to gauge feedback about any issues called in to support. If everything goes well a full rollout commences about two-weeks later and generally takes about three weeks to complete. I'd expect 11.0f to start showing up for most folks in a few weeks or so.
     
  10. Mar 23, 2010 #5410 of 10248
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
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    Jan 4, 2003
    I think you're referring to Margret Schmidt's post about 11.0f resolving MRV issues:

    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=7833681#post7833681

    Since TiVo doesn't support and/or recommend upgrades, I seriously doubt if anyone from TiVo will ever comment about the Intellipark issue.

    EDIT: I should have mentioned that TiVo did address the soft reboot issue with the HDXL's which one can only assume was the same Intellipark problem we've run into. I don't think it's a big leap to think that they would include the same code in v11.0f, but only time will tell.

    So we'll see if we all get it by month's end!
     
  11. Mar 23, 2010 #5411 of 10248
    MPSAN

    MPSAN Active Member

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    Jun 20, 2009
    Portland,...
    Phantom, did you change the Unit name before connecting the LAN? I know you changed the IP, but did not mention the name of the Unit...Like BedRoom, etc.
     
  12. Mar 24, 2010 #5412 of 10248
    Phantom Gremlin

    Phantom Gremlin New Member

    1,555
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    Jun 20, 2002
    Tualatin,...
    I don't think you can change the name from the TiVo itself; you must do it from your account on tivo.com. And then it takes days, rather than hours. Possibly involves some reboots.

    Anyway, I think the name is a whimsy; just something to make your life easier. If it's more than that, I'm in trouble. Because, just a few hours ago, I swapped the names of two units around to match where they ended up, ie something like: BedRoom became Den, Den became BedRoom. I'm living dangerously, but I'm hoping this won't break anything.
     
  13. Mar 24, 2010 #5413 of 10248
    cwerdna

    cwerdna Proud Tivolutionary

    9,821
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    Feb 22, 2001
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Yep. I'm no newbie but I ran into this the first time I was helping someone w/a Series 2 w/a dead drive and had to make an image from a friend's working Series 2. Ugh... it was quite a puzzle until I looked it up and remembered the whole clear and delete jazz.

    I don't recall this being an issue w/Series 1s (used Dylan's boot disk and BlessTiVo IIRC)... but then again, I was never dealing w/foreign TiVos. The backups I made always came from the unit itself. Back when I first started this, there was no way to make a truncated backup w/the software only. You had to have a spare hard drive at least as large as the original A drive as a backup.

    I hit this again recently when I finally got an image for my Tivo HD w/bad A drive. The first thing I got was to run the initial guided setup I don't think think there was a way around it. I got through it all the way, couldn't do squat... got "error 51" and so doh! That's right, I have to clear and delete. :eek: Ugh!
     
  14. Mar 24, 2010 #5414 of 10248
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
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    Jan 4, 2003
    I've swapped names on ours a number of times...no problems at all. But like you say, sometimes it takes a while.
     
  15. Mar 24, 2010 #5415 of 10248
    MPSAN

    MPSAN Active Member

    1,194
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    Jun 20, 2009
    Portland,...
    OK, I was asking as I had posted a question regarding the use of a Truncated image from 1 THD being used to restore another. My point was that I have FIOS M-Cards and thought that the good image of the drive I created when upgrading the FamilyRoom to 1 TB could be used in a bind if there were ever an issue with the other 2 THD's that are still "stock". From your post it looks like I can do this if I do a CLEAR once brought up.

    I suppose that in a bind, you, Rich, or I could meet at Washington Square and exchange a CD. :D
     
  16. Mar 24, 2010 #5416 of 10248
    wired4net

    wired4net New Member

    3
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    Sep 24, 2007
    Kind of a long story, so please bear with me. For anyone who just wants the BOTTOM LINE:

    Beware of using "wdidle3 /D"
    My experience suggests that "wdidle3 /S300" is the safer option.

    A few months ago I upgraded one of my two TIVO HD's to a WD10EADS 1TB HD. This was my 4th upgrade of a TIVO or DTIVO over the years. I had been reading in the forum (thanks to all posters) about the possibility of needing to apply the IntelliPark fix using wdidle3.

    When I got the drive (from Amazon), I somehow thought its build date was outside the window of problems, so I did not use wdidle3 and merely did the upgrade. After failing soft booting I realized I was wrong, but just never got around to doing the mod. No problems at all for several months.

    Last week the TIVO rebooted overnight and failed to start. I figured now was the time to do the mod. The TIVO had just received OS 11.0f, so I first pulled the plug, restarted, and let the new OS install. Then I immediately took out the drive and applied the "wdidle3 /D" fix as instructed. wdidle3 reported that the timer had been "disabled". Re-inserted the drive and soft-rebooted OK. When I next looked at the TIVO, it was frozen. Over the next day of fiddling with it, the TIVO kept rebooting at odd times right in the middle of watching live TV or looking at menus or whatever. Often, the boot wouldn't complete without pulling the plug and trying again. So, what caused this: TIVO broken, drive failing, or 11.0f OS change?

    In frustration, I called TIVO service. A nice fellow there told me that the problem was likely the TIVO itself, since they had reports of random reboots with the TIVO HD. He pretty much dismissed the possibility of a problem with 11.0f. Of course, the drive could also be at fault. We discussed return possibilities, but I agreed to test the drive first.

    I tested the drive in the TIVO with the short tests using the "reboot, pause, 5, 4" trick. All OK. Then I pulled the drive and tested it over and over with the long tests on my PC using the utility from Western Digital (windlg.exe). All OK. Then I put the original 160GB HD back into the TIVO.

    The TIVO using the old drive insisted on an immediate upgrade to 11.0f before it would do much of anything. (Guess their records show it now has or must be updated). That went fine, and then the original (incredibly smaller drive) worked fine over the next day or so.

    Meantime, I played with wdidle3 and the WD10EADS. Had trouble running it more than once without rebooting the pc, but that seems to be a documented problem. Googled quite a lot and found that some sites suggested merely setting the IntelliPark time to max (5 min., or 300 sec). I had thought that that was probably what the app did when told to "disable". Apparently not. Reapplied the fix with "wdidle3 /S300" to set park time to 5 min.

    Finally, I put back the WD10EADS 1TB drive into the TIVO. That was about 4 days ago, and it has been running great ever since. Soft reboot works, has 11.0f, no random reboots.

    So, go figure. I haven't found anyone else describing an experience like this. Maybe it has something to do with an incompatibility of 11.0f with whatever state the drive is in when IntelliPark is "disabled". Maybe it was a fluke. I don't know. But for sure, and for me:

    no wdidle3 fix and OS 11.0d = soft reboot fails but no other problems
    "wdidle3 /D" (IntelliPark disabled) and OS 11.0f = serious problems with random reboots and soft reboot failures
    "wdidle3 /S300" (IntelliPark after 5 min.) and OS 11.0f - soft reboot works and no other problems
    WD10EADS drive tests OK.

    I welcome anyone who can clear this up.
     
  17. Mar 24, 2010 #5417 of 10248
    LockRob

    LockRob New Member

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    Aug 24, 2003
    Yes- that is why I went that way. However, I guess because I didn't purchase it from the Tivo website, they felt they could raise the issue. He stated that there were several model numbers of the WD expander, and that he wasn't sure that the one I had was supported.

    What can you do at that point? I said it was, he said he wasn't sure, and that was as far as he was going to go.
     
  18. Mar 24, 2010 #5418 of 10248
    cjv2

    cjv2 New Member

    290
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    Dec 15, 2009
    Atlanta, GA
  19. Mar 24, 2010 #5419 of 10248
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
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    Jan 4, 2003
    For a price. :eek: :D
     
  20. Mar 24, 2010 #5420 of 10248
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

    8,893
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    Jan 4, 2003
    Either the TiVo CSR was uninformed (everybody is new to the job at some point) or there was a communications breakdown. There are only two Western Digital My DVR Expanders: a 500GB and a 1TB model. (Both drive boxes feature the TiVo logo BTW.) Those are the only two eSATA drives approved and supported by TiVo. TiVo only sells the 1TB version now but you can still find the 500GB drives for sale elsewhere. No matter where you buy one, as long as it is one of those two drives TiVo will support it and in the event of a failure, Western Digital will replace it in the first year.

    WD makes a number of other eSATA drives, none of which are called "My DVR Expander" or have the TiVo logo on the box (or referenced anywhere else).

    If you connected the eSATA drive to your TiVo HD via plug and play it would have to be the WD My DVR Expander as no other eSATA drive will work.

    Hope that helps...and hopefully you'll get a different CSR if you have to call in again. If you still run into problems make sure you get a support case number and then ask for a supervisor.
     

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