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Drive Expansion and Drive Upgrade FAQ

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by bkdtv, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. Mar 17, 2010 #5321 of 10316
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

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    If your 1TB WD My DVR Expander didn't give you any trouble and you're not planning on reusing or repurposing it I'd pull it out of its enclosure and give it a try first. (That will void the one-year warranty of course.) I'd run WD's Lifeguard extended diagnostic on it to be sure everything's okay. There's no reason to think that it will be any more or less reliable than any of the other drives you could buy. The 1TB WD's in our TiVo's have been flawless. I'm also using some of the 1TB Hitachi's mentioned and a 500GB Seagate DB35. All run cool and quiet.

    If money is no object I'd probably opt for Western Digital's A/V dedicated WD10EVDS (would need the "Intellipark" feature disabled per the first post) or the Hitachi which has quickly become one of my favorites (adjusting the AAM will make it very quiet). Fry's has the retail kit in Renton for $89.99 if you can't wait. ;)
     
  2. Mar 17, 2010 #5322 of 10316
    cwerdna

    cwerdna Proud Tivolutionary

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    Feb 22, 2001
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Thanks for all the advice!
    It's hard to say at this point if my 1TB Expander was the source of any probs. I already ran the Lifeguard extended diagnostics the other day and it passed. I hadn't done so on the stock 160 gig drive as it seems hosed anyway (unclear if it due to drive probs or a bug). FWIW, KS 54's SMART and overnight tests both run until completion passed on both drives as well.

    But yeah, maybe I'll try running some additional tests just be sure as I probably won't repurpose it nor hook it up to my fixed TiVo.

    I have no backup since I never cracked the box on my Tivo HD yet. I need an image that I friend of mine might be supplying me.

    Amazon's less preferable unless they're way cheaper because I'd have to pay sales tax since I'm in WA, which is where their HQ is.
     
  3. Mar 17, 2010 #5323 of 10316
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

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    KS54 isn't actually a TiVo diagnostic, but a SMART (Self-Monitoring, Analysis, and Reporting Technology) test they've added. There are many, many similar reports wherein a drive or drives passed KS54 but ultimately failed or didn't pass more conventional computer diagnostics (and vice-versa). At this point I'm not so sure it's worth having on TiVo since it seems so unreliable, at least in the TiVo environment.

    It's unlikely that either hard drive actually affected the other. The boot partitions are kept on the internal drive and recordings are striped across both. It's more likely that the internal drive simply failed.

    Using another TiVo's image may or may not work out. If not, you can always get a copy of Instant Cake.

    Let us know how things go!
     
  4. Mar 17, 2010 #5324 of 10316
    cliffdwelling

    cliffdwelling New Member

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    Tucson
    I am trying to do an Mfscopy but for some reason WinMFS does not show my new WD10EARS drive in Destination drives. Windows recognizes it and so does WinMFS as drive 0 and my original drive as drive 1 when I select drive.
    I also realized that WinMFS says that WD10Ears is not a Tivo drive.
     
  5. Mar 17, 2010 #5325 of 10316
    dt100

    dt100 New Member

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    zipzoomfly has a pretty good price on the hitachi 7k1000.c, if you don't mind dealing with a rebate. That is where I got mine. Packing seems good, and fast shipping. I have no connection with them.
     
  6. Mar 17, 2010 #5326 of 10316
    Generic

    Generic Now in Dolby Digital

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    Dec 26, 2005
    SoCal
  7. Mar 17, 2010 #5327 of 10316
    pl1

    pl1 Active Member

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    Jan 17, 2007
    MA
    You can't beat that with a stick!
     
  8. Mar 17, 2010 #5328 of 10316
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

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    Jan 4, 2003
    Okay, I'm confused (nothing new). Based on what you've said, winMFS does indeed recognize your new drive (drive "0") and since you haven't done anything with it it would be correct that it's not a TiVo drive. If it recognizes your original drive as "drive 1" and your new drive as "drive 0" there shouldn't be any problem running the program. Or maybe I just missed something? :confused:
     
  9. Mar 17, 2010 #5329 of 10316
    rhattala

    rhattala New Member

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    Jan 20, 2008
    Tivo S3 Instantcake upgrade problem
    Ok my 250 original driver crapped out on me, so i decided to upgrade to a 500GB WD green drive. So i got a copy of instant cake for S3 tivos and took the new drive and had a successful "bake of my cake" on the drive. Heres were the problem starts... i put it back in the tivo and nothing... only welcome, powering up! I have let it run for over an hour and nothing. So i decided to try to image the drive again and still a no go... im stuck! Is there something im missing or has the box itself gone bad! any suggestions would be helpful Thanks!

    The Drive upgrading to is WD Green Drive is WD5000AAVS
     
  10. Mar 17, 2010 #5330 of 10316
    cliffdwelling

    cliffdwelling New Member

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    Jan 29, 2009
    Tucson
    It only recognized my new drive when I checked the box(view mounted drives).

    When I tried to copy my drives, the new drive was not listed as a destination drive.

    Anyways ,I did a truncated backup of original drive -took it out and then restarted computer with new drive . I ran WinFMS and delete format and it now recognizes the new drive as a Tivo drive as before it said "Not a Tivo Drive".

    I ran restore from backup and that seemed to work. I will try to install later but still would like to preserve recordings from original drive. It may have been my controller settings as I only had one expansion bay open and the sata cable was for a optical drive.
    What is the easiest way to connect 3 hard drives to computer?
     
  11. Mar 17, 2010 #5331 of 10316
    gages97

    gages97 Member

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    Mar 24, 2004
    So today I tried a replacement Hitachi. Same issue, restore from WinMFS looks like it works, but system will then not boot all the way. This time it booted then gave me a GSOD.

    I downloaded instacake, copied image to drive, and now all is fine.

    I took my original drive and did the instacake and also fine.

    Some weird buy going from 750GB to 1TB?

    I am using latest WinMFS.
     
  12. Mar 18, 2010 #5332 of 10316
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

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    Ah, got it now. If your computer is fairly recent it should have at least two open SATA connectors. Connecting both drives to the MB is the best/fastest way to copy everything over. Otherwise you can use a USB/SATA adapter or a dual drive docking station (eSATA or USB)...that's slower but it will work.
     
  13. Mar 18, 2010 #5333 of 10316
    Kevin R

    Kevin R New Member

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    Jan 15, 2009
    Finally am ready to start the upgrade.:up:
    Recieved my WD10EVDS from amazon (their HD packing has greatly improved).:)

    I ran the wdidle program and all seemed to go well EXCEPT, when it ran I noticed it listed both the WD10EVDS AND my caviar black 1T.
    Same notice for both "idle3 timer enabled, set to 3720 seconds".:eek:

    Did I mess up the black drive by leaving it in the system when I ran the program, and if so, how do I undo it? Do the blacks even have the idle set and if so at what?:confused:

    As far as the Tivo, I plan to just do the backup and reload, since my PC only has two sata ports, and I don't have a usb adapter.
    Wish I had done this a few weeks ago.
    With the Olympics putting everything else in reruns, once they cleared I had almost nothing left on it. Now I'm back to a dozen or so HD shows that I either lose or back up through Tivo desk top, which isn't really very fast.

    Kevin R
     
  14. Mar 18, 2010 #5334 of 10316
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

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    If your TiVo hangs on the "Welcome! Powering up..." screen it means that the mother board cannot communicate with the hard drive. Don't take this the wrong way, but is the drive connected and powering up? If the drive is powering up can you hear seek noises (clicking) for a while or at all?

    What happened to your original drive? Why do you think it quit...what symptoms did you see?

    It's possible something is wrong with your TiVo but more likely something is up with the drive. Is the drive new? Did you run any diagnostics (like WD's Lifeguard)? Are you sure you loaded the correct IC image? Could it have been one for a TiVo HD instead of a Series3 or vice versa?

    IIRC there is a troubleshooting section for IC...have a look at that and see if something makes sense.

    Let us know a little more if none of that helped.
     
  15. Mar 18, 2010 #5335 of 10316
    cwerdna

    cwerdna Proud Tivolutionary

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    SF Bay Area, CA
    Dumb question.

    I haven't opened up my Tivo HD nor Expander yet. From looking at the pics at http://www.gizmolovers.com/photos/tivo-hd-review-photos/, are the two SATA connectors on the motherboard identical? I'm unclear. If so, I was thinking I could disconnect the bad A drive and connect the eSATA one to the A drive SATA connector thus making the Expander the only drive in (outside) the system. It's hokey, but it's way of ensuring the thing works ok (once I get an image) w/o I voiding its warranty.

    Not sure if I'd want to run that way permanently since the 500GB Expanders seem to have questionable reliability. I'd probably only want to run that way (at most) until the Expander's warranty runs out and then just move the drive internally. I'd imagine it should still work w/o loss of recordings or anything.
     
  16. Mar 18, 2010 #5336 of 10316
    ADG

    ADG Allan

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    Aug 19, 2003
    New Jersey, USA
    1) You should have disconnected all drives except the WD10EVDS
    2) The utility should only effect the WD10EVDS unless the Caviar has the same power setting. And even then the worst that will happen is that setting has now been disabled.
     
  17. Mar 18, 2010 #5337 of 10316
    pl1

    pl1 Active Member

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    Hey Rich. Have you ever tried a dual dock copy yourself? I'm just curious, since I have not tried it. But according to what I've read, it can clone a drive within it's own device.

    So my thought was, once you start the procedure (either via USB or eSATA), wouldn't the transfer occur within the docking station itself? Or do you think it would still have to go to the PC from the source and back for the destination? Just curious.

    When I do get one, I can test it out. If there is no hdd light activity on the PC, that would be a good indication that it is not using the PC. I guess the best test would be to use a USB connection and see if it goes as fast as an SATA connection.
     
  18. Mar 18, 2010 #5338 of 10316
    bciocco

    bciocco Member

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    Mar 28, 2009
    I am not Rich. But, I did do the upgrade with a dual docking station. I am not sure whether the pc is used or for what purpose. It did take about six hours to copy the information from one drive to the other using MFScopy. The drive lights on the dock flash rapidly and I did not hear and disk activity on my pc.
    I am thinking it uses the pc for something. The MFScopy program is able to tell me that progress is occurring. If it was entirely within the dock, I don't know how the status would be available.
     
  19. Mar 18, 2010 #5339 of 10316
    pl1

    pl1 Active Member

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    That's what I was thinking. Thanks for the feedback. So, it does appear that the docking station is transferring data direct from drive to drive.

    There is an option (I believe) to clone disk to disk with no PC. Would that work for a TiVo without WinMFS? I'm not sure. But, I might just try it, out of curiousity, since it should be an exact clone.
     
  20. Mar 18, 2010 #5340 of 10316
    richsadams

    richsadams Active Member

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    IIRC both are standard SATA ports on the TiVo MB but I no longer have a TiVo HD to check. And you're right, it's hard to tell from the photo. The two ports are obviously a little different as are the cables, but I think they are both normal SATA ports. Perhaps someone can verify that?

    I think a couple of folks here have connected an external multiple-drive array directly to the secondary SATA port. However I don't know if they used an eSATA > SATA or a SATA > SATA connection.

    So you're proposing disconnecting the primary drive's SATA cable and swapping the eSATA cable into the primary SATA port on the MB (assuming they have matching ports)? I don't know if that would work or not. (I would disconnect the SATA/Power cable going to the primary drive so TiVo isn't powering it up if you do that.) The bridge in the enclosure may or may not affect TiVo's ability to "see" the eSATA drive as a primary drive. I don't know why it wouldn't work or why it would harm anything but I don't know if anyone has tried it either. I also don't see any reason that eventually installing it permanently wouldn't work either, but again, the whole eSATA/bridge thing might affect it somehow.

    In any case, that would be a whole new twist on things and if it works certainly get you into the TiVo Pioneer's club!
     

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