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Does Tivo have any competitors?

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by Gifted1, Oct 16, 2013.

  1. Nov 10, 2013 #61 of 177
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Like I said with the possibility that CableCARDs could be going away in the next few years that may not be true. If the industry shifts to some new technology MS would need to recertify MCE for the new technology. Since MCE is discontinued that's unlikely, and because the certification process is so expensive it's unlikely a 3rd party will pop up to fill the void. I'm sure PC based DVRs for OTA will remain for the long term, but for cable their days are likely numbered.
     
  2. Nov 11, 2013 #62 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    I wouldn't expect MCE to be recertified for any new technology since it's no longer supported. I'll be curious to see what happens on the cablecard front if that technology is going away. People with existing cablecard devices aren't going to be very happy if their provider suddenly tells them their hardware will no longer work on their system. I'd suspect that existing cablecard users will still be able to keep their cablecards while any new customers will have to use the newer technology for getting their TV signals.

    I'm not sure what the laws regarding cablecard use stipulate, but I'm pretty sure that if you have a cablecard device that you want to use then the provider still has to support it. Any new technology will probably have to allow for cablecard use well after the new technology is implemented. Otherwise, I can see lawsuits galore against the cablecos, with Tivo at the forefront.

    Things could get very interesting.
     
  3. Nov 11, 2013 #63 of 177
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    Cablecard won't be going away for a long time because it's embedded in millions of cable STBs now. Support for third-party devices is what you have to worry about with the FCC's incomprehensible Charter decision.

    This will hopefully be a moot point if the FCC enforces the requirement that cable come up with an IP access standard by end of next year, which could enable Tivo and others to ditch cards (and hopefully attract new entrants, lack of competition being the biggest issue with Tivo today). Last I saw Verizon and others were working on it.
     
  4. Nov 11, 2013 #64 of 177
    heyted

    heyted New Member

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    Another option, in some cases, for those that like to tinker is a HTPC running MythTV and other open source software. This is not an option for those people that have cable with the channels not flagged "copy freely". Fortunately for me, Comcast has all nonpremium channels currently marked "copy freely" except one in my area. The exception is MoviePlex, but I can stream MoviePlex movies from the Comcast web site, so it is ok. I canceled all of my premium channels many months ago, and I use Netflix.

    You can purchase complete HTPC hardware with no operating system, or you can put together your own HTPC. To save money, I recently used a TiVo Premiere case and hard drive to put together my HTPC. I am not the first person to do this -- do a search for MythVo. There are no mandatory service fees. I used to not like the idea of using a computer as a dvr, but I have been happy with it so far.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    I purchased another TiVo Premiere a couple months ago, and I sold the wireless adapter, power supply and remote that came with it. Here is the cost break down with the total prices shown including shipping:

    Tivo = 40 purchased - (7.53+8.03+26.85 sold) = -$2.41
    Hauppauge WinTV-DCR-2650 Dual Tuner Digital CableCARD Receiver = $114.95 (I could have paid less)
    ZOTAC Mini-ITX Motherboard D2550ITXS-B-U = $167.99
    4GB Crucial DDR3 2 2GB Memory Modules CT25664BF1339 = $37.68 (I could have just purchased 2 GB)
    Total = $318.21

    The Atom processor in the motherboard listed above is a good choice because of its energy efficiency. The processor can easily handle the load thanks to the NVIDIA GeForce GT 610 that plays friendly with Linux with full hardware acceleration. I have Mythbuntu installed and the award-winning XBMC media player.

    A warning if others want to try this:
    I originally carefully drilled many holes in a circular pattern above the fan. After testing it, the assembly went from nearly silent to sounding like multiple untuned whistles. The alternative worked out well -- I cut out the sheet metal and glued on black foam to protect the fan. It runs very quiet.
     
  5. Nov 12, 2013 #65 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    I've got a mini-ITX setup with an AMD E350 as a satellite HTPC in the spare bedroom. It was painfully slow until I recently installed an SSD for the OS drive. I'm not all that crazy about the mini-ITX platform because you only get a single PCI-e slot and they tend to cost more than either a micro-ATX or full-sized ATX setup. Cases are way overpriced as well. It seems like the smaller you get, the more it costs, with fewer expansion options available. I'd actually prefer an Intel NUC or a Gigabyte Brix to a mini-ITX platform for a satellite system. They can be used with more powerful CPUs for better performance (i.e., faster menus, etc.). It's not a good choice for DVR use unless you can set it up with networked storage to hold the recordings. There are several different network tuner options available.
     
  6. Nov 12, 2013 #66 of 177
    lessd

    lessd Active Member

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    This thread has turned into "is there any other way to get a DVR function besides TiVo (or a DVR from a cable co)?" that has little to do with the OP original question as DIY DVRs are not competitors of TiVo any more than your a competitor of local plumbers because you fixed a faucet in your own home.
     
  7. Nov 12, 2013 #67 of 177
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    The OPs question has been answered. The answer is No.
     
  8. Nov 12, 2013 #68 of 177
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    And that's a sad but true answer.
     
  9. Nov 12, 2013 #69 of 177
    atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Active Member

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    Yes I gave a detailed answer in Post #7 and hear we are at Post 69, I guess we just like to ramble on :p.
     
  10. Nov 12, 2013 #70 of 177
    cherry ghost

    cherry ghost Active Member

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    Lock the thread
     
  11. Nov 12, 2013 #71 of 177
    TIVO_GUY_HERE

    TIVO_GUY_HERE I miss the ocean

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    I know this isn't what the OP was asking but I got a fee DVR from TWC for 1 year, and even for free, what a piece of crap that is.
     
  12. Nov 12, 2013 #72 of 177
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    Same ole, same ole -- why pick on this thread? :p
     
  13. Nov 13, 2013 #73 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    Like most threads, once the original topic has been satisfied, the thread tends to diverge into other (somewhat) related topics. Whether the thread gets locked or not is entirely up to the mods. Since it hasn't devolved into a pissing contest or something derrogatory to other members, I see no reason to lock it. If the current topic is of no interest to you then why not simply ignore it? It will eventually die of its own accord.
     
  14. Nov 13, 2013 #74 of 177
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    Or even if the original topic has not been "satisfied"!

    Hint for those unhappy with thread: Thread Tools ... Ignore this thread
     
  15. Nov 13, 2013 #75 of 177
    cherry ghost

    cherry ghost Active Member

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    My point was that if a mod is going to make a statement like that, then he should lock the thread
     
  16. Nov 13, 2013 #76 of 177
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    Just when we're getting pictures of hotrodded S4 cases?

    The fun's only beginning!
     
  17. Nov 13, 2013 #77 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    Based on that statement, if I fix my own faucet, then I'm taking potential work away from a local plumber. That sounds like competition to me. :D

    On a similar note, I used to own a multitude of Tivos going back to the original HDR-112 SA Tivo up to the S3 digital cable models. I started going the DIY route with a HTPC and several OTA tuners when I had DirecTV and they were just making the switch to their non-Tivo HD DVR. I dumped DirecTV and switched to FIOS just so I could continue using Tivos.

    When the InfiniTV4 came out, I stopped using Tivos altogether. Had it not been for cablecard tuners for PCs I'd still be using Tivos today. When one product supplants another, it becomes a competitor to the original product, regardless of whether it's a niche product or one that's commercially available.

    There are actually quite a few turnkey HTPCs available and there used to be a lot more. Now, HTPCs aren't going to take away a significant market share from Tivo, but it does dip into their customer base. That's enough to qualify it as a competitor, even though it may target a slightly different market than Tivo. I don't think there's any specific percentage of market share that signifies whether or not one product is competition for another. If a product provides a similar function, then it's a competitor, plain and simple. Just because some people don't see it that way doesn't make it any less of a fact.

    From the OP's original post:

    A HTPC configured as a DVR definitely falls under this category. Here's just one example:

    http://assassinhtpc.com/

    So the answer to the OP's original question is Yes, there are other companies that sell DVR units.
     
  18. Nov 13, 2013 #78 of 177
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I think my statement was misinterpreted. I meant the OPs question was answered so there is no harm in derailing the thread to talk about MCE, or whatever. Threads have a tendency to evolve over time. It's part of the fun of this forum. As long as the OPs question was answered I see no harm in leaving it open to go in whatever direction you guys want.
     
  19. Nov 13, 2013 #79 of 177
    lessd

    lessd Active Member

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    Assuming your not a license plumber people are not going to hire you to do plumbing for them so your not competition to any plumber, as mowing your own lawn does not make you a competitor to landscapers. I and most of the people on this forum change their own light bulbs, are they competition to electricians??
     
  20. Nov 13, 2013 #80 of 177
    alansh

    alansh New Member

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    There are two dates to keep in mind: the end of regular support, and the end of extended support.

    The main difference is that extended support does not offer non-security bugfixes. However, by the time the OS gets that far pretty much all of the non-security bugs that they're going to fix have been.

    So for most people, the end of extended support is the real drop dead date. After that date, you may be vulnerable to newly discovered security bugs. If you're willing to take the risk, though, you can keep using them. I expect XP to carry on for quite a while still.

    The end of extended support:
    XP SP3: 4/8/2014
    Vista SP2: 4/11/2017
    Win7 SP1: 1/14/2020
    Win8.1: 1/10/2023 (however, a later service pack will extend that date)

    The only real gotcha would be if they discontinued the program guide, or started charging for it. They reserve the right to do that, with a 30 day notice, but a 3rd party could provide the data. There's no other "kill switch" that I'm aware of in Media Center.
     

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