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Does Tivo have any competitors?

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by Gifted1, Oct 16, 2013.

  1. Oct 18, 2013 #21 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    I'm no fan of extenders due to their inherent nature. The SageTV extenders were supposed to be far and above anything available for WMC, but unfortunately they're no longer in production and SageTV was bought out by Google and buried in a closet. The irony is that a patch was developed to allow the Ceton tuners to work with SageTV for unflagged content. I was just starting to evaluate it when Google pulled the rug out from all SageTV users. I couldn't have bought a SageTV license even if I wanted to. There's nothiong more frustrating than having some big company buy out a smaller one and quash a great product just to eliminate any potential competition.

    Aside from SageTV, WMC was just about the only option for a whole house solution, good or bad. Extenders work reasonably well for playback of recorded and live TV. I just don't like the lag time with the remote commands and constant network issues. I used to get network errors all the time on my extenders and the network would always test fine when I ran the network tuner app. It just got too frustrating to deal with.

    Ceton got screwed by Microsoft on all fronts. The Echo won't work with Windows 8 and the Q never saw the light of day.
     
  2. Oct 18, 2013 #22 of 177
    lessd

    lessd Active Member

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    Your correct, so one would need more than the average knowledge to put together or even know about Intel NUC, this is a alterative to TiVo maybe, but not directly competition to TiVo as I doubt TiVo has lost a large number of sales to this or any PC solution, BUT I know that TiVo main competition is the cable co itself, ATT and Comcast X1 (just to name the ones available to me) do get most of my friends, not just because of cost or better hardware, but they love the on-sight service at no extra cost, if Comcast correctly charges a TiVo customer a cable card with all tax adds about $9/ month to ones cable bill, and the cable co has deals for multi room DRV viewing.
     
  3. Oct 18, 2013 #23 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    The Intel NUC, as well as the Gigabyte Brix, is a very small form factor PC that can be geared towards HTPC use. Due to its small size, it cannot accommodate anything but a mSATA drive, which tend to be a bit scarce, small in size, and not exactly cheap. They are energy efficient and can handle up to an Intel CORE i7 CPU, depending on the model. Intel is introducing a new model with a slightly larger case that can accommodate a 2.5" drive so that's good news. There's also word that a Celeron edition selling at around $139 will also be introduced.

    There are no other internal expansion slots so if you plan to use it as a DVR you'll need an external tuner, either networked or USB, and an external drive for storage. I see them mostly for use as a satellite HTPC and not a primary HTPC, but they're certainly capable of being one.
     
  4. Oct 18, 2013 #24 of 177
    Balzer

    Balzer Member

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    I saw something called Simple TV, although I wouldn't consider it a legitimate competitor to TiVo.

    It's a single tuner, and works only with antenna. No cable/satellite. It actually doesn't connect to your TV either. Apparently it's just for streaming to wireless devices. Although their website says it streams to Roku, so should be able to get on the TV through that.

    Also, you have to supply your own external hard drive.

    But I see that it does have remote streaming..

    Oh, and premier service is $60/year, or $150/lifetime.

    www.simple.tv
     
  5. Oct 18, 2013 #25 of 177
    Balzer

    Balzer Member

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    Hmmm.. I also found that the yearly or lifetime service is tied to the user, not the box, so you could have as many boxes as you want for that cost..
     
  6. Oct 19, 2013 #26 of 177
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    Single tuner and OTA only (now that clear QAM is mostly going away), plus you have to supply your own storage, for $300 all in? On the flip side it does offer mpeg4 transcoding like Tivo, but still, single tuner for what they want to charge?

    Not much of a competitor IMO unless you're seriously cash-strapped, a Roamio Basic with or without the Stream would be way better than this.
     
  7. Oct 19, 2013 #27 of 177
    Curt

    Curt New Member

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    Settle down keyboard commando. No built-in storage, but it can be used with external equipment as a DVR. Unfortunately there's no direct competition to TiVo, which stopped innovating in 2010.
     
  8. Oct 19, 2013 #28 of 177
    yokito

    yokito New Member

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    Not that I have followed TiVo much after 2005 when I sold my first TiVo - just wondering about the Stream and the Mini - those have been around since 2010?
     
  9. Oct 19, 2013 #29 of 177
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    The Stream was released last September and the Mini wasn't released until this March. They also released the new Roamio line in August.
     
  10. Oct 19, 2013 #30 of 177
    cosmicvoid

    cosmicvoid Tivo noob

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    I am OTA only, no cable available in my area.

    My first DVR was the Sony DHG series, but when Rovi pulled the plug on TVGOS last year, that became a boat anchor.

    So I put together a HTPC with Win7 WMC and 2 SiliconDust HDHomeRun ATSC dual tuners. Having 9TB of storage was nice. But living in the boonies, the OTA signals from Seattle are not excellent, and I found that the HDHomeRun tuners were not good at handling multi-path signals, so I had to look for an alternative.

    Just in time to discover the Roamio, whose ATSC tuners do a fine job of locking to multi-path signals. This is the first Tivo product that came close to offering what I need.

    A bit OT for this topic, I guess, but for me the problem is finding a DVR that has ATSC tuners, which are becomming uncommon; so the 4 tuner Roamio is a welcome find. So for me, the only two contenders are Tivo and HTPC (if I could get satisfactory tuners). But the WMC software is annoying and prone to crashing (task manager to the rescue a couple times a week), so even though its free, its still a hassle.
     
  11. Oct 20, 2013 #31 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    The V-Box Cat's Eye ATSC tuners were excellent at dealing with multi-path interference. They were available in both USB and PCI versions. You can probably still find them on ebay once in a while dirt cheap.

    I've got several of each I'm no longer using if you're interested. Drop me a PM.
     
  12. Oct 20, 2013 #32 of 177
    atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Active Member

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    Same experience here, my Roamio does a much better job with OTA multi-path reception issue than my HTPC with HDHomeRun tuners. Hopefully SilconDust will update the tuners in the OTA HDHomeRun (and maybe go to a 4 tuner unit), just for reference the HDHomeRun Tuners are about the same as the tuners in my Premiere.
     
  13. Oct 20, 2013 #33 of 177
    Curt

    Curt New Member

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    No, but neither of them are innovative.
     
  14. Oct 22, 2013 #34 of 177
    Scyber

    Scyber Former ReplayTV User

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    Samsungs new cablecard supporting cable box will be an interesting test to the market:

    http://www.engadget.com/2013/10/17/netflix-confirmed-samsung-smart-cable-box/


    While I realize it isn't a DVR, if it is successful samsung may decide to make a DVR (or since it has USB, possibly even a software update will work). In addition, if successful other manufacturers may be more willing to enter the market.
     
  15. Oct 22, 2013 #35 of 177
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    Wishful thinking IMO, the future is IP-based channel delivery (via cable or not), not more card-based stuff. The FCC has asked the MSOs for a standard way to do IP by end of next year.
     
  16. Oct 22, 2013 #36 of 177
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

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    Samsung already makes a DVR that is furnished by Time Warner Cable.
    Amen. A pox on CableCARD and especially on Tuning Adapters.
     
  17. Oct 22, 2013 #37 of 177
    mr.unnatural

    mr.unnatural Active Member

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    Ellicott...
    That's fine for on-demand and streamed content, but how will that work with hundreds of available channels? Aside from overloading the available bandwidth, it will also put a huge damper on channel surfing, which a lot of people still do. Going to an IP-only based solution will likely mean long waits between switching channels which simply won't sit well with a lot of customers. It will also mean highly compressed content to cram it into the limited bandwidth when trying to feed every household simultaneously.

    Frankly, I don't think the current technology can handle it, but then I'm no expert on the subject. I have no problem sticking with what's currently available for a multitude of reasons.

    The one question I have is whether the content would be streamed live or would it be available as VOD? Live streaming would probably require some sort of tuning adapter to keep bandwidth requirements reasonable.
     
  18. Oct 22, 2013 #38 of 177
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    This is how SDV works now, so it wouldn't be any worse then what most people are already seeing. The switch to H.264 will create a bigger delay then switching to IP as the compression used for H.264 means there are less safe entry points for the decoder which means it has to wait longer before it can actually start displaying video.
     
  19. Oct 22, 2013 #39 of 177
    dianebrat

    dianebrat I refuse to accept your reality TCF Club

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    I have to love how the OP set up the topic, then off they went, leaving us to go off on our own tangents :)
     
  20. Oct 22, 2013 #40 of 177
    lessd

    lessd Active Member

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    Good point as TiVo has no serious retail competition; except the renting of a cable co.s own DVR. You can't go into say Best Buy and purchase any DVR except one made by TiVo. That is the only real answer to the OP question.
     

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