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Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by moyekj, May 11, 2012.
What would be an example of a local channel that wasn't available locally over the air?
On-demand is paid for and licensed, plus providers are looking into monetizing these with additional advertising. Hulu is also paid for and not ad-free. Amazon and Netflix are ad-free, but paid for.
How do you know Dish isn't paying to offer this?
I don't recall offering an opinion in either direction above. Having said that, I strongly suspect they're not paying. Not yet, anyway. DISH generally shoots first, asks questions later. And frequently litigates. However, given the fine print they seem to be acknowledging some programming will be excluded -- suggesting they're open to negotiation and/or will not index certain content based on certain factors. I have a recording of CEO Clayton's intro of the service, but haven't listened to it in its entirety - but I assume he doesn't mention partnerships or industry support as we would have read about them.
Yes, aside from NYC, LA, and maybe Chicago, all locals are on spot beam on Dish. This actually results in some of the carriage disputes Dish has with local stations as the spot beam footprint can me much smaller than the traditional OTA range of the station. The local stations do not like losing those potential eyes.
I think it's highly unlikely that dish did this without some sort of negotiation with the networks or without the contractual language in their carriage contract. And if the networks are on board, they must feel they are being adequately compensated for the service, as with on-demand and Hulu.
I imagine you will be proven wrong and I will be proven right. The question is, will the networks do anything about it?
NBC is already making noise:
Bet a wooden nickel that before the end of the week Dish will kill the Ad-Zapper.
More noise from NBC:
Well I'll admit I was wrong..! They have some pretty big balls implementing this without getting them on board!
The networks are going to need to adapt. They are right that ratings should be counted year round and not just during sweeps. It's insane to only count a few weeks of the year. Technology allows us to measure practically every second of TV viewing. There is no good reason not to.
The networks have been much too slow to adapt and now technology is finding ways of giving people what they want.
MANY "local" stations are paid for the priviledge of Dish/Directv/Cable/etc carrying them.
A station can demand to be "must carry" - if it's a dink it certainly will demand that.
It can ask for compensation at the risk of cable/sat telling them to go pound sand. Usually the large giant markets (NY, LA, Etc) demand money. Also stations that are owned and operated by mega companies that also control "important" cable channels bundle themseleves and demand more. So for example all disney owned stations try to link themselves to ESPN as a bundle. Dont pay the 7 bucks a sub for ESPN then you dont get ABC (and the rest of the bundle).
I wouldn't know for sure but i'd say its likely that a majority of the population is served by one or more channels that demand compensation.
It's been years (since S3 came out) but last I knew LA and NYC are only allowed if you live in a location that doesn't have local station of a particular network. So you aren't actually in a market. If it were a market you would need to get that markets channels. So only a certain pockets of like montana or other "middle of nowhere" places and the like can get NY or LA.
Many years ago before satellite had the ability to carry all the different markets channels they were allowed to sell everyone NY and LA. Back then the sat companies broadcast each channel across the entire US. Now a days they have spot beams (like a flashlight from space) that aims at a specific area and only sends certain channels to that area. This allows them to reuse their limited spectrum over and over again so that rather then sending hundreds of local channels all over the US (which they dont have enough spectrum to do)- they only send the 8 from NY and LA everywhere and then the other hundreds they limit to just to a local area reusing frequencies over and over.
You have to tell the satellite company your zipcode and then they authorize your box for the specific channels you should get in that zipcode. If you move and you are not under the specific spot beam that has those channels anymore then you wont get anything- unless you call them up and tell them you have a new address. For example I live in the last zipcode for the NY area- one zipcode south you get Philly. If I moved to a mile or two down the road to the next zipcode south unless i told them i moved i wouldnt continue to get NY locals (and the NY RSN)
Directv (and I assume dish) has either an antenna in your area someplace to pickup the channels - or more likely (at least for larger stations) in this day and age they get a wired (fiber?) feed from the station just like your local cable provider does. They aggregate a bunch of locals and send them up to the satellites together (I seem to recall via a local satellite uplink but actually maybe they internet them to one of their main uplinks now?)
Hmmmm- shocking from the company that was aware of tivo's patents yet used infringing code anyway for years, even after being found guilty to the point of the judge debating charging them with contempt of court. Shocking too from a company that has repeatedly been admonished and/or censured in court.
it's Ergen's M.O. It seems to have made him a very rich man, so maybe he's not so dumb after all...
bet tivo would agree with that.
This is from Fierce Cable with noise from Fox as well:
From what I read it only applies to the four networks, it record all the prime time shows for that night. Then some how strip out the commercials and then make the all the shows available the for viewing WITHOUT the commercials the next day. I am going assume it only keep them for one day and replace them the next night prime time shows. The lawyers are going have fun with this
How is Dish doing this? Recording all the shows and then paying people to remove the commercials?
By adapt you mean that the networks should all become premium channels where everyone pay $10.00 a month to view?
I'm surprised they're not going the other route and trying to insert NEW commercials into the old commercial slots, then making the advertisers or networks pay them for the ability to serve up new commercials appropriate to the day the viewer is watching.
Last week's Mother's Day promotion then gets replaced with this week's Memorial Day one.
Directv does it!
They insert local commercials in slots designated for that purpose just like cable does, only directv does it at the dvr.
Sounds good. As a Coloradoan, I always keep my eye on Dish as an alternative to Xfinity.
They do count the ratings all year round. Although during sweeps there is a much larger sampling of people used. And the future ad rates are based on those ratings during sweeps.