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DIAL Support

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by takeagabu, Aug 20, 2013.

  1. gothaggis

    gothaggis New Member

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    Mar 3, 2010
  2. tatergator1

    tatergator1 Active Member

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    I've done my best to follow this discussion, but I'll admit I'm still not completely on board on DIAL vs Chromecast. But all this talk has me thinking that the Premiere's YouTube app is not far from this currently. With the exception of actually launching YouTube on the Premiere, you can completely control the Premiere YouTube app via the YouTube mobile app. You simply "pair" the mobile YouTube app to your "TV" (Premiere in this case). So, If I'm understanding everything DIAL is the last link.

    The Roamio's will support DIAL, which is the "control" mechanism for the missing links described above. From the YouTube Mobile app, I'd pull up a video, and then tell it to play on my "TV". This would then pass a request via DIAL to the Roamio, basically saying "Launch YouTube" and then the rest just falls into place with the Mobile app then communicating with the Roamio YouTube app similarly to the current Premiere/Mobile YouTube interaction..
     
  3. tlc

    tlc Member

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    DIAL is just what the acronym says, DIscovery And Launch. Launch can mean an application already on the server (the TiVo).

    Are there any dial servers here? Yes.
    Cool, do you have a YouTube app? Yes.
    Ok, I'll let my user launch things at you.

    The app can also be an HTML5 browser and a URL can be passed.

    Control of the launched apps is not specified by DIAL. ("outside the scope")

    Source for the above: https://sites.google.com/a/dial-multiscreen.org/dial/dial-protocol-specification , sections 3.1 - 3.3, 5.

    Google Cast adds a proprietary protocol RAMP that's already being reverse engineered. One partial analysis is at https://github.com/entertailion/Fling (Also, that's a working Java app that serves to chromecast without the google SDK.)

    RAMP appears to add control -- play, pause, etc. between the sender (tablet) and receiver (Chromecast).

    I know from looking at the Google SDK, sender apps pass custom (for each web provider client) tokens that are used for authentication, authorization and specifying the desired media. The Javascript to do the auth & auth are also custom, loaded with the html.

    People are already building software that does the Chromecast side of things. (Cheapcast, leapcast, picast)

    Take aways:
    • Saying DIAL is supported doesn't mean DIAL with a browser is.
    • Saying DIAL is supported doesn't mean the launched app will be controlled by the tablet.
    • TiVo might just mean they'll let tablets LAUNCH the apps they have anyway, which can then be driven by the remote.*
    • DRM is in there somewhere. HBO Go isn't going to let people copy movies by sending streams just anywhere. So providers will have to approve of the receiver. This speaks to the idea of "everything just working".


    * This isn't so bad from a usability standpoint. I miss my hard buttons when I want to pause my chromecast. But it's bad that it might not enable an explosion of supported services.
     
  4. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Nevada
    I've been using this a bit lately and it's pretty cool! :up: The Netflix app is a lot easier to browse on my iPad and the Netflix app on the TiVo only takes a few seconds to launch, and is actually usable once it does. which is a stark contrast to the Netflix app on the Premiere.

    I don't watch a lot of YouTube, but I have flung a few things to that too and it works equally as well.
     
  5. innocentfreak

    innocentfreak Active Member

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    Florida
  6. Philmatic

    Philmatic Member

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    Sep 17, 2003
    Has anyone tried the latest iOS Hulu app with the Roamio? They just added DIAL/Chromecast support, I'm wondering if it works already or if it needs an update from TiVo.
     
  7. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

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    The APP will need to be updated for this to work.
     
  8. Toeside

    Toeside Circa Dec 2005

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    St Louis, MO
    The app on the TiVo?
     
  9. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

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    Yes, both the app on the device and the app on the TiVo need to be updated to support the DIAL protocol.
     
  10. Toeside

    Toeside Circa Dec 2005

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    St Louis, MO
    That makes sense. I hadn't thought about the changes tot the receiving side. Hopefully tivo's Hulu Plus app is updated soon.
     
  11. rainwater

    rainwater Active Member

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    Sep 21, 2004
    It would require a complete rewrite. Adding Chromecast support is easy because the app that is downloaded remotely only needs to be a small html5 file to play encrypted video. For DIAL support to work, Hulu would have to rewrite the entire app for TiVo. So while Chromecast uses the DIAL protocol, adding Chromecast support is much easier than adding DIAL support to an existing app.
     
  12. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

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    Hulu doesn't have an HTML5 implementation as far as I know. They discussed that a few years back and decided it wasn't ready.

    But that really doesn't matter - our Netflix implementation isn't HTML5 either. I have no idea how much effort it would be to add DIAL support to our HULU implementation - or how much incentive the have to do it.
     
  13. rainwater

    rainwater Active Member

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    Sep 21, 2004
    They do for Chromecast since it requires it. But it is not a full app. It is just a small HTML5 wrapper than can play Hulu videos (there is very little UI required). That is why adding Chromecast support on the host is much easier than DIAL support.
     
  14. anthonymoody

    anthonymoody New Member

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    Apr 29, 2008
    I know Tivo Margret is busy with the tuner/CC situation but app development plans and updates are something I'd very much appreciate.
     
  15. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    They don't typically talk about that kind of stuff. They just release apps whenever they're ready.
     
  16. CrispyCritter

    CrispyCritter Purple Ribbon Wearer

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    North...
    The community here will take any statement the Tivo is working on something as a promise that it will be released and then complain about broken promises and it not coming out "on schedule", so why would TiVo pre-announce more than they have to? Especially for apps which are being written by the content source and who's release timing is not under TiVo's control.
     
  17. anthonymoody

    anthonymoody New Member

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    Apr 29, 2008

    I never said they "have to" did I?

    That said, you're being a TiVo apologist. Just because they may have a history of promising and not delivering, or not communicating at all,doesn't mean it isn't possible. Development timelines are a standard part of any tech business, soft or hard. And yes **** happens and timelines slip, but on the whole it's very much standard practice for these things to be communicated, at least in a general way (eg saying Q4 rather than November 12), more than not. Even moreso for public companies. And yes even when outside partners are part of the process.

    Said another way, the request is a reasonable expectation given the broader hardware and software community practices.

    TiVo may suck at this, but that doesn't mean I can't ask anyway.
     
  18. tom_da

    tom_da New Member

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    Feb 10, 2005
    YouTube works fine. Even when doing something else on the TiVo. Quality in the video is grainy at first, but seems to sense when it can increase and gets better. You can control from the phone, pause/play, change where in the video it was. You can queue up another video to startup next. But backing up seems to lose where in the app it was and you never get back correctly again, lost in the TiVo app.

    NetFlix is a bust. All it does is start the Netflix app on the TiVo with the typical lists. NOT the video you were expecting from the Netflix Google app. The Google app seems to never finish and it times out while the TiVo app goes off looking for the lists to display. Even if you already have the video playing on the TiVo, 'casting' from your phone resets NetFlix back to the start screen of lists. Totally useless.

    I notice a difference in the two when you click the 'cast' icon. YouTube assumes you want to cast 'away' to other devices and only lists them. (like my TiVo Premiere) NetFlix adds your phone to the list too, apparently to let you switch back to 'local'. Bet this is where the screw up is. The two TiVo apps are probably expecting the same implementation of the protocol to be followed. The two Google apps probably AREN'T in sync. What ELSE is new inthe s/w world?!
     
  19. djdanska

    djdanska New Member

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    Sep 30, 2004
    the Netflix android app on my HTC one and nexus 7 2013 have no problem starting Netflix videos from the android app. Works flawlessly here. Its extremely helpful to fast forward or search a video that way. I have a chromecast too.
     
  20. srauly

    srauly New Member

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    Apr 26, 2000
    Simsbury,...
    I realize this is a really old thread, but I was hoping to find an updated list of TiVo Roamio apps that support DIAL via an iPhone.

    Does the Pandora app support this? I'm getting my new Roamio Plus delivered by Monday and was hoping that I could use my iPhone to cast/Airplay (whatever you'd like to call it) Pandora stations to the Roamio, rather than have to navigate stations via the TiVo remote.
     

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