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20.3.8 is still broken

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by fletchoman, Dec 15, 2013.

  1. lessd

    lessd Active Member

    7,695
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    Jan 23, 2005
    CT
    The only problem is your 100% signal power may be 101% no problem, or 190% that could be a problem, TiVo should re-do that signal meter like the old VU meters, say low if less than 40% OK from 40% to 60% and good from 60% to 80% than too high above 80%.
     
  2. nooneuknow

    nooneuknow TiVo User Since 2007

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    Feb 5, 2011
    Cox Cable...
    I can understand (while I used to not understand) why TiVo goes with their 0-100 scale, instead of dBmV readings like MSO STBs (excluding MSOs that use TiVo).

    What stands out is that the standardized dBmV readings on even ancient STBs would change color (Green/White=good, Grey/White=acceptable, Yellow=borderline, Red=not acceptable).

    If TiVo did this, or extended the scale to be 0-200, or presented a scale bar with a pointer indicating where you are on that scale, or presented both scale and dBmV readings, it would make EVERYBODY'S life easier.

    Think of how many support calls could be eliminated for TiVo, MSOs, and end-users alike.

    IMHO, other than keeping a consistent (consistently poor implementation, which TiVo excels at) end-user experience, it just makes no sense for them to keep using a method that creates so many issues, resulting in so many headaches, all around.

    The dBmV reading would tell anybody involved the exact level of attenuation required, rather than guessing, and spending more time/money buying more attenuators, because the ones used still don't get it right, having to use trial and error to get the right one. With any device that uses a true dBmV value, I have never had to get and install an attenuator more than once.

    Unless they like headaches, and are in bed with the attenuator market, it makes no sense.

    Also, there's another factor involved. Cox, in my market, does not allow their installers/techs to use attenuators. All attenuation must be achieved with splitters, and if that means using a six-way, and capping off the unused ports with terminators, that is how they do it.

    I even have to do it this way. If I call them out for an issue, or for signal level/quality testing that my equipment can't do, and they spot any attenuators, they will remove them, and install splitters and terminate any extra ports that may be left. They will try to take away my attenuators, unless I protest that that are owned by me. They are instructed to eliminate attenuators and take them with them when they leave.

    I'd also like to see TiVo redo how they calculate SNR. They obviously don't use the same method as what is the standard. It's way past time for them to calculate it the same way MSO equipment does. In a true SNR reading, there is no such thing as too high a SNR. My best guess as to why TiVo keeps it as they do, is to compensate for their 0-100 scale, and use the SNR as a means to identify a "hot" (excessive) signal. This is just leads to more headaches and confusion/frustration for all. Again, poor implementation of things, leading to headaches, all around.
     
  3. moyekj

    moyekj Well-Known Member

    11,134
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    Jan 23, 2006
    Mission...
    Agree 100% the current diagnostics #s are all but worthless. I have dB #s in the 40s and signal strength 100% for all tuners and things are working fine. Others with issues have posted similar #s from diagnostics. i.e. The way it is now you cannot know for sure from the #s if you have a signal problem or not.
    If for some reason TiVo doesn't want to share the true meaningful #s then at least they should have a means to obtain the measurements from your TiVo remotely so that they can tell you if there really is a problem or not. Right now as soon as a CSR hears you have db #s in the 40s they give you the standard crap that your signal is too "hot" whether or not that really is the case.
    I think suggesting to TiVoMargret that current Diagnostics #s be updated to be more meaningful may be worth pursuing.
     
  4. nooneuknow

    nooneuknow TiVo User Since 2007

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    Feb 5, 2011
    Cox Cable...
    I agree 100% with that, as well. Although, this whole topic really belongs in the threads with titles like "Tivo is blaming V53 error on SNR ratio?", and other similar threads.

    By all means, pursue away. I can't see any reason for anybody to *not* want TiVo to get with the program, and use standardized measurements, readings, and calculations.

    I'm sick of explaining to Cox why a SNR greater than 36 is too high. I'm sick of being told what I already know about true SNR.

    If they want to display it their own proprietary way, they should at least give a separate measurement by the standards, or give an option like "press enter to view advanced signal diagnostics", like how they added "Press enter for advanced options" at the beginning of Guided Setup, which adds the hidden menu item of "Installer Express Setup".

    If they could add that (which didn't exist in early software versions), there's no reason they couldn't put all the technical data (the "good stuff") related to signal & SNR in standardized format, where those who know what dBmV & true SNR values mean, can get to it, and those who don't know what it all means can never have to see it, unless prompted to provide those readings, or a cable tech is there and needs those values, without TiVo's stupid secret representations that defy logic.
     
  5. HarperVision

    HarperVision TiVo's Italian Cuz!

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    May 14, 2007
    Paradise...
    Well there's the problem, you used TiVo and logic in the same sentence!
     
  6. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    It is definitely not the attenuator...system failed to record this evening again.

    Tivo is sending another unit to replace this one, I will let everybody know how the second one works.

    Note: you will see a scheduled recording missing; when you open history it will show a status of "no signal".
     
  7. nooneuknow

    nooneuknow TiVo User Since 2007

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    Feb 5, 2011
    Cox Cable...
    In order to see them you need to select the view mode with the Red "C" button to "show(all)".

    If you don't, it's not a "conflict", so the default view doesn't display them.

    On top of that, if you don't open the additional info, it's not clear why it didn't record, just that it didn't.

    EDIT/ADD: I really wish TiVo would add a viewing mode just for "missed recordings" that have nothing to do with the guide data, conflicts, or your recording parameters (new only, new & repeats, record everything), etc.

    It's a major PITA sifting through "show(all)" mode, adding insult to injury, and could really incite a psychotic break for those who have a view other than "It's only TV, big deal".
     
  8. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    One small twist...

    Tivo now wants me to send the unit to them before they send me a replacement. Wow, what was terrific customer support has now been erased by stupidity.

    A very nice tech support person (Conner) is now supposed to call me back tomorrow to let me know if they can send a replacement first...after checking with a supervisor.

    don't they know I have been using Tivo for years...with 2 lifetime subscriptions???
     
  9. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    Once again my failure was with one scheduled recording...
     
  10. mattack

    mattack Active Member

    20,734
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    Apr 9, 2001
    sunnyvale
    So you're CALLING TIVO and/or REPORTING THIS ON THEIR FORUMS, right?

    Otherwise, you are effectively talking to a wall. Tivo does not follow these forums! To get ACTUAL HELP from someone who can help, you need to contact them.
     
  11. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    I'm doing both... And I am logging my issues here in this forum so others can see the solution I have achieved.
     
  12. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    OK... The incompetence at TiVo has been staggering and frustrating.

    I was promised a call back from Connor to confirm that they would ship me a new TiVo to replace the one that defective, unfortunately I never got a call back.

    When I called TiVo again I was charged full price for a new system in order to get it shipped out before sending back the defective unit.

    Today I called because they had disconnected the service from my current Roamio, I was told this is standard practice and I would have to pay 12.99 to get a one-month extension extension on my current unit.

    Wow... They knew I was continuing to use my old unit ...and they knew my new one would not arrive for sometime... But they seem to only know one procedure.

    I was finally able to get a supervisor to fix things by returning my previous license back to my old unit... But now when I get my new Roamio, I won't be able to transfer between the two because TiVo doesn't have a way to have two active lifetime subscriptions on two different units... They want me to actually pay for a month subscription...

    I must be the first and only one to ever have a problem with my TIVO...;-).
     
  13. Bierboy

    Bierboy Seasoned gas passer

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    Jun 12, 2004
    Quad Sillies
    Why should they care about you? You're not adding anything to their monthly bottom line with lifetime subs...
     
  14. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    So the second Roamio has now failed in the same exact way that the first one did... More details later
     
  15. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    I have now tried two different Cisco cable cards, two different TiVo Roamios.

    Today I missed the college football game that was supposed to record, again with only one scheduled recording. Tuner two was the failed tuner again...

    I called TiVo and went through all of the diagnostic information, they said I was experiencing the problem with too many tuners... Then they recommended that I use a Motorola cable card

    I called Comcast to ask but they indicated that I was not eligible to use a Motorola cable card.

    I can't believe that nobody else is having this problem...
     
  16. HazelW

    HazelW Member

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    Dec 6, 2007
    No. Va
    A lot of us are. See the thread on tuners 5 and 6 not working.
     
  17. jntc

    jntc New Member

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    Dec 5, 2013

    Are you able to see what tuner is failing? If so, how? And how did they go through the diags? When I've called them, they simply shrug me off with "This is a known issue with Comcast not supporting six tuners - you need to get an updated firmware from them" - Comcast (at least in my area) does not arbitrarily 'give' you an updated firmware. It's a system wide push done when all of their testing is done and they are ready to push it out. Comcast tells me they can't push out to a single user.
     
  18. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    Look under DVR diagnostics for the details of each tuner; Look back at my first post to see the pictures of each screen...the pictures form yesterday are too blurry to post unfortunately.

    NOTE: I am able to start 6 simultaneous recordings manually...so I don't believe this issue is related to the unauthorized tuner issue.
     
  19. jntc

    jntc New Member

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    Dec 5, 2013
    Okay, that's what I did as well. I am also able to set 6 simultaneous recordings with no issues. But am still plagued with the v58 screen of 'angry family'!
     
  20. fletchoman

    fletchoman New Member

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    Dec 15, 2013
    I have called and reported the problem to TIVO, I also called Comcast and reported the problem to them. Comcast blamed TiVo for the problem, and TiVo blamed Comcast...

    The TiVo technical support person recommended that I turn off two of the tuners... When I told them that I can record six channels at the same time manually, they didn't know what to say...
     

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