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20.2.2.1 now available

Discussion in 'TiVo Premiere DVRs' started by TiVoMargret, Nov 28, 2012.

  1. Dec 9, 2012 #121 of 324
    L David Matheny

    L David Matheny Active Member

    1,608
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    Jan 29, 2011
    SE Ohio
    That is interesting. Obviously the data stream being sent out by the TiVo is not being discarded in the case of a recording, so maybe the bug is just that somebody decided to force a jump to the new channel whenever a channel change occurs. That makes no sense since a channel change affects what is being written to disk, not what is being read from disk. The output routine shouldn't care what channel the tuner is on. The previous behavior of continuing the now-orphaned data stream until its end is more logical and much more desirable. Maybe some programmer thought he had a better way to do something, but he hadn't thought it through sufficiently.
     
  2. sea7kenp

    sea7kenp New Member

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    Dec 5, 2012
    Seattle, WA
    The difference with different channels is that the recording normally starts on the other Tuner, where I don't notice this problem.

    2 tuner. So far, that's plenty enough for me.

    I'd noticed something like that way before this update. If I start a recording say, 10 minutes before the start of a program, and am watching, I'll lose several words (up to a couple or so sentences) between "live TV" and "live, recorded TV". Same thing happens if I end the show with the first 5 minutes of the next show. I never let THAT bother me. But losing the climax of a murder mystery or Science Fiction show? OUCH!!!

    Thank you and best regards,

    Ken Parker, Seattle, WA
     
  3. sea7kenp

    sea7kenp New Member

    15
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    Dec 5, 2012
    Seattle, WA
    Thank you, David. TiVo probably doesn't think it's "discarding data" at all. In fact, it's the time shifting that's lost. In fact, thanks for giving me a way to describe this problem: "continuing the now-orphaned data stream until its end". I consider anything OTHER than that to be a Bug.

    Thank you and best regards,

    Ken Parker, Seattle, WA
     
  4. chrispitude

    chrispitude New Member

    518
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    Apr 23, 2005
    It looks like we caught lots of things during the early rollout, but not early enough to fix them before general rollout. To me, this seems to defeat the purpose of having the early rollout.

    (I work for a large software company where we have internal alpha and customer beta test periods every six months.)
     
  5. gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
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    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    just sent the following email to tivo:

    hi margret: sorry to be writing yet again on basically the same subject, but the latest update has literally destroyed previous wishlist behavior (such as the (-) flag keeping anything from recording) and how the shows in /my shows/ are presented. basically it is impossible to maintain files in folders anymore, they just pop out into the general index seemingly at random.

    for example, i flagged a show inside a wishlist folder as a keeper and the system promptly kicked that program out of the folder into the general index area. this means it is impossible for me to put it back into the folder or delete it because it will disappear from within the folder as well. there is more behavior of this sort where i haven't even been able to put the action together with the reaction.

    the root of the problem seems simple. back in the original tivo days there wasn't enough storage to even worry about this sort of thing. but with 3-4 tb of storage someone like me can have literally 100s of shows recorded at only 50% usage. there has to be a better way of organizing the main way you index your recorded shows.

    for an example, when the iphone came out all you had was pages and pages of single apps and no real way to search for them. i had hundreds of apps and there were many i forgot i had because i just couldn't get to them. but apple recognized the problem and first implemented a folder system where you could make your own folders and add apps to them. then they implemented a search, and then later even a voice search with siri. tivo doesn't need to go that far (siri's an inconsistent assistant at best and i rarely use it except for an app search), but i would hope that you're hard at work at some solution to this problem as i write this so we'll have something within the next year.

    meanwhile, i'm at a complete loss at how to manage my shows with this update blowing up my wishlists and the new wishlists i've had to create to replace them exhibiting such random and destructive (destructive to my sense of order, that is) behavior.

    thanks!

    /guy
     
  6. MHunter1

    MHunter1 TiVo Bug Hunter

    300
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    Oct 11, 2007
    Silicon Valley
    Here's more strange behavior related to channel changing:

    If the TiVo is idle on a Program Summary screen or the My Shows list for less than 15 minutes and a scheduled recording begins (such as the clock turning to a new hour or half-hour), the screen jerks Left one level on its own and the highlight moves up by the number of tuners that just began recording.

    For example, in the following screen capture video, notice I park the TiVo on "Book TV"'s program summary screen then go to Live TV to show the clock says 6:29pm. I press Left to go back to the program summary screen and, at 6:30pm, the screen moves left ON ITS OWN to the My Shows list as one new program begins recording and the highlight jumps one row ABOVE the one I was just parked on.

     
  7. sea7kenp

    sea7kenp New Member

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    Dec 5, 2012
    Seattle, WA
    This is the one where "orphaned data streams" are discarded prematurely, with TiVo "jerking" you to the start of the new program, now recording. I've been experimenting with this since it started, noting that, if there's only a short time remaining in the "orphaned data stream" (meaning previous show, with the time intact that you'd hit pause), everything's ok.

    My suspicion is that this has to do with if "local commercials" were in the time-span between where you are, in your viewing, and the start of the new recording. In other words, Comcast might have placed their OWN "important announcements" inside this time span. And, if that's the case, TiVo loses your place.

    Thanks to every one of you who have contributed to my understanding of this issue! I'm a "big picture" person, who delves into details when I need to. Otherwise, my TiVo is a "Utility" to help me watch TV! (And I strongly suspect that a HUGE majority of TiVo users fit into this category). This is one reason I SINCERELY hope that TiVo never drops SDUI menus. (Yes, I believe MANY have purchased Premiere line TiVos, who do NOT have HD TV sets. Forcing them to navigating HD Menus, when their TV doesn't support it would be a disaster!)

    Best regards,

    Ken Parker, Seattle, WA
     
  8. Arcady

    Arcady Stargate Fan

    3,960
    2
    Oct 14, 2004
    Philadelphia...
    I haven't seen this issue. Could it be related to a tuning adapter? I don't use them.
     
  9. CoxInPHX

    CoxInPHX COX Communications

    2,370
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    Jan 14, 2011
    Phoenix, AZ
    I am also seeing this and am not happy about it.

    Does anyone remember if it was possible in a prior SW version to record the remainder of the Buffer after the next shows time-slot has started. I could have sworn I used to be able to do this?

    Example rewind into the prior show and Hit Record, did that last portion of the show record. There currently is not an option to record.

    Is this possible on a Series 3?
     
  10. proudx

    proudx New Member

    198
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    Sep 16, 2008
    Margret,

    Being able to use channel up and down while in a folder to go through the shows/episodes in that folder was a feature we always had on the TIVO and SDUI. Can you please make sure this gets fixed in the next update? It has never worked in the HDUI.'

    Thanks!
     
  11. sea7kenp

    sea7kenp New Member

    15
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    Dec 5, 2012
    Seattle, WA
    In the past, if I got to a program in progress, plus the end of the prior program, when I hit record, it would include some of the prior program. Now, it immediately starts the recording at the beginning, discarding the end of the prior show.

    Don't know about Series 3. Besides my Premiere, my other TiVo is a Series 1 Sony, running Software level 3.001-1-010!

    Thank you and best regards,

    Ken Parker, Seattle, WA
     
  12. mattack

    mattack Active Member

    20,942
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    Apr 9, 2001
    sunnyvale
    If you mean it's, lets say, 8:15, and you rewind to 7:50 and try to record the remainder of the 7:00-8:00 show, then NO, this did not work… (Even though as far I remember, I think the display told you it would record that show.)

    But if you mean you record and you get 8-9pm show PLUS some of the buffer, then yes. (Though the pause point starts at where 8pm effectively is.)

    I've thought this was annoying too.
     
  13. CoxInPHX

    CoxInPHX COX Communications

    2,370
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    Jan 14, 2011
    Phoenix, AZ
    Yes, that is exactly what I meant. I know my Cable Co DVR can do that. Perhaps I am confusing the two DVRs.

    I wish TiVo could do that, I often find myself swapping tuners and seeing a guest at the end of Leno, or Letterman and wishing that buffer could be recorded. But there is always YouTube :)
     
  14. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,400
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    As long as Leno or Letterman are not yet over in real time, you can record the buffer, because telling it to record will be telling it to record that show.

    It's only when the time at which the next show is scheduled to start has already passed that a record command flushes the buffer.

    TiVos don't really record according to time, or, for that matter, channel, they record according to shows, and just do so between the start and stop times they have listed for that show and on the channel they have listed for that show.
     
  15. CoxInPHX

    CoxInPHX COX Communications

    2,370
    11
    Jan 14, 2011
    Phoenix, AZ
    In my case the show is usually already over, and I am seeing the end of the show on the buffer, but it had a music guest I would have liked to record. I know I could record every episode, but that's not the point.
     
  16. mattack

    mattack Active Member

    20,942
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    Apr 9, 2001
    sunnyvale
    Doesn't solve your problem, but that's why I record all of the late night talk shows -- musical guests. kmttg now even allows transfer from pause point, so it's even easier to just save the musical guest.
     
  17. sea7kenp

    sea7kenp New Member

    15
    0
    Dec 5, 2012
    Seattle, WA
    I'm surprised to have experienced the OPPOSITE behavior last night. This "new" behavior occurred when I recorded a program, and then continued watching the program after it. The recorded "data stream", between 5pm and 6pm finished, and the new program at 6pm was on. I was about 5 minutes (or so) before the end of the program, and there were commercials between the two shows (which doesn't always happen, by the way). So I try to fast forward to the new show, and TiVo WOULDN'T LET ME! It went to the end of the show, continuing the commercials, and, if I hit the Fast Forward button (right of the yellow Pause button), TiVo would do the low frequency "boop", and do nothing. I could rewind, and forward, same thing. I could hit "next" (under fast forward), which would toggle between start of recorded program and end of recorded program, but keep me "imprisoned" there.

    What finally allowed me to proceed was toggling between my two tuners (via the "live TV" button on the top right of the remote).

    So there is misbehavior on "orphaned data streams", whether recorded or not. And I'm still convinced these are symptoms of the same !!BUG!!.

    Thank you and best regards,

    Ken Parker, Seattle, WA
     
  18. proudx

    proudx New Member

    198
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    Sep 16, 2008
  19. slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

    3,700
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    Sep 19, 2006
    In the ATL
    I have never seen slow channel changes (up, down, or directly) on my Elite no matter what update it has. Using HDUI or SDUI, it's not slow here on Comcast with no TA.
     
  20. Einselen

    Einselen ɹǝsn pǝɹǝʇsıƃǝɹ

    14,163
    5
    Apr 25, 2006
    If you are surfing channels you are using your TiVo wrong, just my humble opinion.
     

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