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Series 3 Verizon FIOS HD compat?

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#1 ·
I was just about to order a Series 3 from TIVO, when I decided to ask that they gaurantee me that it will work with Verizon FIOS HD (I currently have cablevision, however FIOS is already installed in my building and I will be switching as soon as it is available). The sales rep transferred me to tech, who after 15 minutes told me that they had no information on whether it will work with FIOS HD.

So, does anyone REALLY know if a Series 3 will work with FIOS directly (No verizon box to video inputs, IR blasters, etc)?
 
#1,902 ·
S2 boxes work fine with FIOS. You can even use the serial cable with the QIP-2500 Moto boxes but there is still a glitch when switching to a 4 digit channel via the serial cable. 4 digit channels are duplicates in the La Connexion FIOS lineup so this doesn't affect me personally. The serial cable is fine since 4 digit channels are not important to me.

IR blasters work fine - even for 4 digit channels.
 
#1,903 ·
I have found that you can record HD channels also, it just saves them as SD (yeah, I am not sure why you would want to do it either, but I was just testing).
My S2 is connected to a widescreen display, so I suppose I could record the HD version, save it as SD, then stretch it on playback.

S2 boxes work fine with FIOS. You can even use the serial cable with the QIP-2500 Moto boxes but there is still a glitch when switching to a 4 digit channel via the serial cable.
I've never used a serial cable with my S2. What's the actual cable I need to use?
 
#1,905 ·
(From post of 10/27) There is no longer any charge for the CableCard installation.
Where did you get that information?

I just got another TiVo and need a cablecard for it. I called and was informed they would charge me $79 to install the cablecard. I argued that there was no other way for me to get the Cablecard, and they offered to mail me for free, and for 3 months of free rental, one of their DVRs. I spoke to a "supervisor" who said the best they could do was split the cost over 3 payments. Somehow this seems to violate the spirit, if not the letter, of the requirement for companies to supply Cablecards for 3rd party devices. I canceled that appointment and used the online chat feature to order one. They scheduled an appointment and didn't say anything about the cost for the installation. I can't imagine they aren't going to try to charge me for it.
 
#1,909 ·
Oh, you mean it was shipped with the S2? Hmm.... I don't know if I still have it then... I'll have to look.
There are actually a couple of different cables depending on what ports are on each device. If the serial ports on the devices look like mini headphone jacks, I think a standard stereo M-M cable will work.
 
#1,914 ·
It's usually quicker to Google an acronym, e.g:

http://www.netlingo.com/word/aamof.php

There is an "official" TC acronym glossary, linked from the FAQ tab obove.

But AAMOF isn't in it! Does that mean using it is a "technical foul" ? :D

Another thing I've noticed is that (according to the "official" glossary) "OP" means "original poster" or "original post" (depending on context). However some folks here use it to mean "other person", which can be confusing.
 
#1,916 ·
From 10/27
S-CARDs were discontinued 18 months ago and Verizon hasn't carried them in any market since late spring / early summer.

Verizon installers don't have S-CARDs unless they were just removed from another customer's home in the past day or two. When the installer calls 30-60 minutes prior to their arrival, tell them you want M-CARDs so they can pick them up from the office if necessary.

My installer in N. VA said he hadn't seen a S-CARD in almost ten months. All they have at the VA/MD office is boxes and boxes of M-CARDs.
I haven't been on the forums much since my initial install of cable cards for my Fios service back in March. Last week I bought a new Tivo HD XL for my basement, and called to schedule a time to get an M-card for it. The conversation went like this:

Me: I just bought a Tivo and I need a cable card for it.
CSR: Sure...but I imagine you'll want 2 cable cards so you can utilize the dual tuner functionality.
Me: No, I just need 1 M-card.
CSR: We don't have the M-cards yet, only S-cards.
Me: That's funny, because when Verizon came to install a cable card into my other Tivo in March...let me see, that was 8 months ago...they supplied me with an M-card.
CSR: Well, that's not possible. We don't have M-cards.
Me: I'd be happy to take a photo of it and email it to you if you want.
CSR: That won't be necessary. So do you want 2 cards or 1?
Me: I want 1 M-Card.
CSR: I can't order you an M-card. I can either put you down for 1 single card or 2 single cards. What do you want?

Well, it went on from there like a bad Abbott & Costello routine. I got confirmation from him that A) Even if he orders me 2 S-cards, I'll only be charged for the amount of cards the Tech installs, and B) the tech would call me before arriving. So I'm sure that the local tech/install offices only have M-cards (which I'll confirm with them before they arrive), but it also appears that the CSR reps at Verizon STILL have either not been told, or not trained well enough to know that Motorola only supplies M-cards now. It's amazing to me that they don't seem to care enough to fix their facts.

(Having said all that, watch the tech arrive next week with S-cards only...)
 
#1,917 ·
The Verizon CSR was probably told that during their training course 18-24 months ago. That information is out of date.

You only need to order one CableCard. You'll get a M-CARD.

The installer should call you 30-40 minutes prior to their arrival and ask you about the equipment. Tell them you have a TivoHD that requires one M-CARD.
 
#1,918 ·
Very likely. It should be noted, though, that a subscriber can say that they want to order one M-card all they want, but if the CSR has no way to enter such an order, and can only enter an order for a certain number of CableCARDs (generic, or worse, for S-cards), then that's as far as a subscriber can expect to get with the CSRs. So you are taking your chances ordering one CableCARD in that situation -- you could end up with an S-card. I think it might be safer to order two, and then return one.
 
#1,919 ·
I just got 3 m-cards installed today. 2 replaced 4 s-cards on my 2 existing tivo's and 1 was installed in my new tivo. I just ordered cablecards. Didn't specify s or m. When the installer got here he knew the difference and said he hasn't been issued an s-card for months.
 
#1,921 ·
so should I cancel my 2 cards and then reorder 1 card to move from 2 S to 1 M so I only pay for 1 card a month? I mean it makes sense, but how to I explain to the CSR that I am being overcharged because I have outdated stuff...Maybe if i call and claim the cards dont work..
There are several other posts by folks that have done just that...ordered a new cable card to cut back on costs. Some FIOS CSR's understand some don't, but in either case the tech's do understand and will bring M cable cards...installing one to replace your two S cards.
 
#1,922 ·
Very likely. It should be noted, though, that a subscriber can say that they want to order one M-card all they want, but if the CSR has no way to enter such an order, and can only enter an order for a certain number of CableCARDs (generic, or worse, for S-cards), then that's as far as a subscriber can expect to get with the CSRs. So you are taking your chances ordering one CableCARD in that situation -- you could end up with an S-card. I think it might be safer to order two, and then return one.
At the risk of going OT a bit, how did the Fios install go (assuming you made the switch to them)? Everything good with the router over coax in the loft? Happy with everything? (I'll have service in March so it's fun and reassuring to read up-to-date install stories before diving in. lol.)
 
#1,923 ·
At the risk of going OT a bit, how did the Fios install go (assuming you made the switch to them)? Everything good with the router over coax in the loft? Happy with everything? (I'll have service in March so it's fun and reassuring to read up-to-date install stories before diving in. lol.)
I don't think it's off-topic at all... Series 3; check. Verizon FiOS; check. Compatibility issues, etc.; check.

Part 1. (I'll post another update after a month, I suppose.) This will be mostly my impressions of Verizon's FiOS roll-out, my sales experience, my install experience, and my initial impressions after a day or so.

As I mentioned previously, there was a bit of a wait for FiOS to come to town. That's not unexpected. They're not obligated to deploy this their most advanced service everywhere all at once. However, after the fiber was run past my home, I started pursuing the issue of when connection options would be made available to me. I made first contact with Verizon on August 31, 2007, and followed-up (almost all to our local area's engineer -- not just the customer support people) on April 7, 2008, May 12, May 29, June 5, August 12, and November 25 before finally getting a call back on December 5 informing me that we could now order service.

The online sales order system is a bit limited. Specifically, it would not allow me to order CableCARDs online, and indeed forced me to order an HD STB (because I wanted the HD service package). This required me to make a telephone call to fix the order (which kind-of defeats the point of having an online ordering system), removing the HD STB and adding the two CableCARDs I needed. In subsequent communications, and in the online order review page, what was actually ordered was never accurate, either showing the canceled HD STB, not showing CableCARDs, or not showing that two CableCARDs were ordered. (The records on Verizon's side were accurate, the two times I called in to check.)

The customer service folks are reasonably helpful, once you get in touch with them (at least with regard to checking up on the installation order), but getting in touch with them is extremely problematic. On three separate occasions, both the business office telephone number and the FiOS customer service telephone number forwarded me to the "Our office is closed; please call back on the next business day" message, during Verizon business hours. Also, they sent the email asking me to confirm the order and installation appointment, or to call in to address problems, at 5:20AM on a company holiday, with my installation appointment scheduled for a time before their business office was supposed to be open again. Essentially, they said, "Call us before XXX," but they were not in their offices before XXX. A call left on the customer advocate's voice mail was not returned until after my installation was more than 3/4 completed.

All my initial concerns about placement of the router were unfounded. The installer put the router exactly where I wanted it, in my loft, and my new HSI service was up and running. I was able to just plug in my secondary router from my Comcast configuration, after simply reconfiguring the DHCP server on the FiOS router to assign only a limited set of IPs (leaving the rest for static IPs for my secondary router and the other devices in my LAN). The router software is easier to use than I thought it would be, and I even managed to out-smart myself resulting in big problems getting my port forwarding working like it had been with Comcast, but that was mostly because I did a bunch of things that looked similar to what I did with my primary router with Comcast, which are simply not necessary with Verizon's router. It's all working now.

I did have a hard time getting Verizon's router to automatically assign certain IPs to certain devices (by MAC address), like I had done with my old primary router. I'm not even sure that there is a way to do it. In the end, I went to each device in turn, that allowed me to do so, and told them not to use DHCP, and just set their static IPs manually. However, I do have one device (my printer) which requires DHCP, and yet I need to be able to refer to it reliably by IP address (in the printer driver config). I think this is mostly HP's fault, though, for not providing an obvious way to have it assert a specific IP address, relying on the router to always assign it the same one.

I haven't noted a really significant improvement in speed, though. I went from Comcast's 15/5 service to FiOS' 20/15 service, and it is only a marginal improvement as far as I can tell (even after running FiOS' optimizer). That was the main advantage we were hoping to capitalize on, so that's a little disappointing.

Telephone service, itself, was pretty-much unaffected. However, the installer screwed up. He disconnected the alarm system without paying attention to how it was wired up. When he reconnected it, he didn't put it back the way it was, and within an hour it started going off, and reporting a failure-to-communicate error. It also would fail to report the alarm if the trespasser simply picked up the telephone. The installer had no idea what he had done wrong, despite the alarm company trying to explain it to him. (The way alarm systems work, when configured properly, is that the telephone line goes through the alarm system, so that when the alarm is tripped, the system can take over the telephone line and make the call. What the installer did was bypass the alarm system. Instead of being wired
A -> B -> C​
he wired it
A -> C
B -> C​
The alarm company came out and fixed the error -- $165 later. I just heard from the Verizon foreman who agreed to reimburse me for the bill.

I think we're supposed to have voice mail, but I haven't set it up. (I actually don't know how -- the installer gave me a welcome package I'll have to read through.) Our existing Ring-Mate service, though, came through just fine. We're happy about that.

Finally, television: Right off the bat, I lose something: My TiVo S1, which I've been using happily, just like an old VCR, for about 10 years, is not compatible with FiOS in any way, shape, or form. I simply have to take it out of service. My TiVo S2 used to be able to record directly from the cable, using its own tuner. However, in October, Comcast severely limited the number of channels that my TiVo S2 could access (which, incidentally, was actually what changed the Comcast versus FiOS decision from "slightly in Comcast's favor" to "slightly in FiOS' favor"). With FiOS, my TiVo S2, just like my TiVo S1, cannot access any channels from the cable directly, but it can control a FiOS DTA via IR remotes. Given how much trouble I had trying to get the IR remotes to work five years ago, when I tried this with an old Comcast STB, I'm pretty impressed with how successful the TiVo S2 seems to be, using the FiOS DTA as its source for cable. And, of course, we get hundreds of channels now, available to us this way, whereas even at its best, our TiVo S2 could only get 50 or 60 channels from Comcast.

The installer did bring two CableCARDs, which is what my TiVo S3 needs. (It won't work as a dual-tuner DVR with one CableCARD, even if it is a M-card.) There was some problem with one of the CableCARDs, but he resolved it with his little laptop and a quick phone call, before I even realized there was a problem. (I was inserting the first CableCARD into the TiVo S3, and waiting for the TiVo to digest it.) In remarkably little time, the CableCARDs were installed and properly authorized, and I had all the channels I was paying for. Picture quality and signal reliability seem to be very good, though not really better than Comcast -- however, note that I have had great quality and reliability with Comcast in this regard, for a couple of years. What will be a really good test, though, in terms of picture quality, would be A&E or TNT or even USA... if there is any PQ advantage to FiOS, I should see it on those channels. Our first chance to check will be this weekend, when we'll probably watch an episode of White Collar recorded off Comcast and one recorded off FiOS, back-to-back.

A note about the TiVo S3, though this has nothing to do with FiOS specifically. I was pleasantly surprised to see it match up all my Season Passes with the new channel number. I didn't like the idea of having to recreate all 50 Season Passes!

I'm not a big fan of the billions and billions of HD channels. Most of the HD channels that FiOS and DirecTV have had for a while, that Comcast is only just now starting to provide, are utter crap, and hold very little interest for my wife or I. Having said that, we will appreciate WGN America HD, if it provided more reliable access to Legend of the Seeker in HD. (Our local station that shows Legend of the Seeker tends to move it around without updating their program guide data!) The only other channel that FiOS offers that Comcast does not, that has captured my wife's interest, at least, is Veria, though that's not in HD. However, I think there might be others, again SD channels -- not HD, that may capture our attention, and accessible, now, to our TiVo S2. That'll be a plus.

We do have a three month trial for HBO and Cinemax, and it really shows where a lot of the bandwidth is going: 25 HD channels, and even more SD channels, devoted just to those two premiums... I won't count right now, but I bet there over 50 HD channels, and an even larger number of SD channels, which are either premium or on the Sports tier. When we cancel HBO and Cinemax, the advantage of FiOS TV will be seriously undercut.
 
#1,924 ·
Finally, television: Right off the bat, I lose something: My TiVo S1, which I've been using happily, just like an old VCR, for about 10 years, is not compatible with FiOS in any way, shape, or form.
I have my S1 working happily with Fios. I have one of the mini STBs (the little black box with no display for $3.99/mo) and my S1 controls it using the IR blasters. It works GREAT. I use it to record the kids shows. It gets all of the stations I subscribe to (not the HD, but the S1 is SD only anyway) without the extra features of a full STB (TV Guide, VOD, etc.). It is PERFECT for use in this manner.

I just didn't want someone reading your post to think the S1 is not compatible with Fios. If I understand your post correctly, you were using the S1 without a subscription and were programming by time/channel.
 
#1,925 ·
@biker:

Good report just a few things.

When did you test the FIoS? I expect that you will see less degradation during busy hours compared to Comcast where you shared fiber bandwidth with everyone else on the same node.

I also have an HP printer (photosmart). The setup software doesn't have a way to set a static IP... but, when I went through the menus on the HP it self there was a way to change it from DHCP to a static IP.

BOb
 
#1,926 ·
I have my S1 working happily with Fios. I have one of the mini STBs (the little black box with no display for $3.99/mo) and my S1 controls it using the IR blasters. It works GREAT. I use it to record the kids shows. It gets all of the stations I subscribe to (not the HD, but the S1 is SD only anyway) without the extra features of a full STB (TV Guide, VOD, etc.). It is PERFECT for use in this manner.

I just didn't want someone reading your post to think the S1 is not compatible with Fios. If I understand your post correctly, you were using the S1 without a subscription and were programming by time/channel.
Yes, thanks for the clarification.... I don't have a valid subscription. It is great to know that, with a valid subscription, the S1 would be able to drive the DTA.
 
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